Unlocking Personality Power: Eric Gee’s Guide to Understanding Yourself and Others

Brad Minus: [00:00:00] And we're back with another episode of life changing challengers again. I'm your host Brad minus, and I am extremely privileged to have Eric G on the show today. He is the author of the power of personality and we will get into his book a little bit later. But. Let me just tell you a little bit of something about this amazing, amazing person.

He is a classically trained pianist, a backyard trained barbecue del del taunt, a three time fantasy football champion, a professional mentor, amateur magician, and infinite pez dispenser of saccharine bits of 80s and 90s pop culture. He's also managed a golf course, hosted a pre podcast show, on a dilapidated radio station, and he, In East Hollywood, coached high school basketball, designed his leadership structure for a Boy Scout troop using his personality type method, lectured on businesses, university, graduated from USLA, where he studied English literature and screenwriting.

And if that wasn't enough, he also has an [00:01:00] amazing coaching program called Utopia. Y O U. Eric. How are you today? Thank you for being on the program. 

Eric Gee: Thank you for having me, Brad, and thank you for that introduction. It was very kind. 

Brad Minus: Yeah, you are the jack of all trades and, um, and probably a master of all of them.

I am a jack of all trades and a master of nothing. But, um, but I'm willing to learn from you. So let me ask you this question. Can you tell us a little bit about your childhood? Maybe, you know, what was the compliment of your family? Where did you grow up and what was it like to be Eric as a kid? 

Eric Gee: You know, I grew up in Los Angeles, you know, I was a typical Asian American.

I was, I think I'm a third gen kid. Um, and I love how you had all those, that description of my background and what I've done, because it's more descriptor of me as a young kid as well. In terms of like, I had a really difficult time always following through with things. I'm definitely someone who gets really excited about stuff.

Even now I'm like that and I'll get into it and do it. [00:02:00] Maybe, especially back then, I didn't always finish what I started. Um, and that was something that I knew in my life that I really had to work on. And as a kid, like, I just started realizing that, you know, I didn't necessarily fit into what was being taught to me like that.

You know, you're always taught, okay, like, do your homework, like, put, put all that stuff in an organizer. You should want to do the steady things to get to where you're going. And I was that kid who was like, no, I had to genuinely really love something in order to do it. And I didn't. Then no matter what my teachers or parents said, I might not do it.

Um, and yeah, that was pretty much my childhood and it was basically not the easiest, you know, I was, I always said I was an AF student, you know, I was, I would get an A if I loved it, I would get an F if I didn't, you know, and not always the greatest for teachers either. Um, and that's what got me into studying personality theory because at a certain point I found that and I was like, Oh, you know what?

I don't have to try to be like everyone else. There are different personalities that we all have. And if I could just learn to pull the strings of my own, then that [00:03:00] one might make me lead to greater success. Right? And so that's what I started doing. Maybe like, when I was in high school, I really started reading up on different personalities.

I got really into the theory. I started doing all the things that you mentioned. As a practical way of like studying and experiencing different personalities of people to where I started my own education company, and I ran that for about a decade and through running that we'd have about 1000 students a year.

I was able to develop my own personality typing methodology, which I wrote in a book that was published this year, which is conveniently conveniently right over my, uh. Left shoulder here. I see. Um, yeah, and it's, and it's been fun ever, you know, it's been a fun ride and I'm, it's still going, um, but yeah, that's how I got to here.

All 

Brad Minus: right, but let's step back here just a minute because you just kind of glanced over it. First of all, I know you have at least have one brother. 

Eric Gee: I do. I have, I am a middle child, you know, I have a younger brother and an older sister, even though in my personality type growing up, my teachers always used to say like, They always [00:04:00] ask my parents like, is Eric an only child?

My parents would be like, no, like he has a brother and he has a sister, you know, but I think With my personality, I was maybe a bit narcissistic or like, just like, just so focused and egocentric on what I wanted and I tried to get what I wanted. I think they thought I was an only child, not exactly a compliment, but, um, yes, I do have a brother long way of answering that.

Yes. 

Brad Minus: So self actualized. So he's got a brother and a sister and just so we know, um, and we've gotten this, um, he actually posted this somewhere, but his brother said. If Eric doesn't like doing something, and it takes longer than 15 minutes, he's not going to do it. 

Eric Gee: That was, yeah, that was in response. I remember that was in response.

I wrote that, I guess, it was in response to a friend of mine who was stopped, who stopped by my house. I was not there, but my brother was there. This is when I was probably like 21 or 22. And my friend who was a CPA at the time, he was just like, hey, has Eric done his taxes yet? And that's exactly what, where that line came from, where [00:05:00] he's like, if it takes longer than 15 minutes and he doesn't want to do it, it's not going to happen, you know, and that's very true to this day, like, yeah, I have someone else do my taxes.

Brad Minus: Yeah. 

Eric Gee: I agree. 

Brad Minus: And that's, that's the way you have to do it. 

Eric Gee: I'm 

Brad Minus: not going to trust him, not trust myself to my taxes. Um, I mean, they're going to get audited and get too much money back, or I'm, I'm going to lose out and end up paying a lot more than I needed to. Um, but that's amazing. So what does your brother do?

Eric Gee: You know, my brother's a software engineer. Um, and he is definitely the type personality who would be pretty good at doing his own taxes and doing the things that You are told to do and doing your duty, not to say that I would not, but it's much easier for him to do something like that. Even if he does not like to do it, it was just like, set his mind to it.

He'll do the dishes. He's that kind of personality where I am definitely one where I'm like, I really love doing it. And if I don't, then it's, it's like pulling teeth to get me to do it. I 

Brad Minus: definitely, I, uh, I, I, I attract with, I, [00:06:00] I can, I, I, I'm the same way. I'm very, very close. Um, and so it's like the two things that are actually working for me is my coaching and this podcast.

Um, these are the two things that I followed up on. This is, you are going to be episode like 48, 58, 59, something like that. Um, so I've gotten past the eight. Right. If I don't know if you've ever, if you ever hear anything about podcasting, it's usually, they usually say, if you can get past episode eight, episode eight is where everybody either continues or drops off.

Uh, yeah, I never heard that. Yeah. Oh, it's actually, it's pretty amazing. There's a, if you look at the amount of podcasts out there, there's over 4 million podcasts. There's only 290, 000 that recently have a episode that has a new episode. Wow. So in 

Eric Gee: other words, I guess it's kind of like, Oh, so it's like running a marathon, right?

Like, I know I just mentioned that cause I know you're an endurance coach, but it's [00:07:00] like, you know, the number of people who start is a large amount, but can you get past whatever that threshold is where you're starting to feel that, what do they call that? The runner's high where you start getting into that like zone.

Brad Minus: Yeah. Or you get past the zone, but in the marathon, it's called the wall. 

Eric Gee: Okay. 

Brad Minus: Yeah. It happens about mile 18, um, is for most people. Um, but interesting enough, there's actually a higher percentage that actually finished, which is good. Um, it nowadays, nowadays we've, we've got enough technology of a back when marathons first started, search started long, uh, logging in, uh, age groupers, what they call it, where it wasn't a professional runner, um, You're right.

You're absolutely right. People would start the marathon and there would be more people that started it than finished it. You're absolutely right. Um, the hundred milers nowadays is kind of where people are now. There's more people that, that finish it. Uh, there's more people that don't finish it than finish it.

Right. 

Eric Gee: But I love the idea of the wall because it also reminds me of barbecuing a brisket just because you mentioned that as well where the [00:08:00] wall where you, the brisket gets to a certain temp and you're like, okay, if you like, let it leave there, it's just going to stay there and you have to just push through, you know, and it's funny that that is also related to smoking.

Brad Minus: Yeah, no, I read that actually. I was like, if you didn't like, it'll. It's got to get past. Yes, it's got to get past this certain threshold and once you get past the threshold, then it'll continue cooking and it'll get juicier versus if you take it off right then it's not going to be juicy. It's going to be kind of tough and rough and it won't actually, you know, you won't be able to bite through it as much.

Yes, I remember something. I remember. Yeah, I remember talking about that. My first time that I tried to do a brisket myself. Um, so let's talk about. So since you talk about personality types, I just, so I'm trying to get around your family and what you grew up in. So let's talk about your, what about your sister?

Talk about your sister. 

Eric Gee: Yeah, that's, that's a great question because we always start with our family, right? I mean, we know them the best. They are the ones that were most likely to enjoy their company and also hate them because their company, right? And annoy us. Um, So like, I'm going to be throwing a [00:09:00] lot of animal, uh, names out here just because my personality types, I define them with animal archetypes.

So my sister would be a shark. And I think in general, you can kind of get what a shark is like, you know, just like a shark, narrow focus, action oriented, um, very active, physical, likes their freedom, likes their independence. And at first glance, they might appear mean just like a shark might because they're almost always on the attack.

Um, and you know, with my sister as an older sister, I always bring that up because a lot of times we, we have that idea that older siblings are always like the responsible caretaker types. And I was like, no, that's not true. It's only true about half the time based on the percentage of the population. But that other half of the time, it's not.

And you're only going to notice that when you actually do have a sibling who that doesn't fit. And for my sister growing up, that didn't fit. She was definitely not like, Oh, let's make sure everything's okay with you younger brother. It's more like, Hey, let's have fun. Let's do a radio show together. When we were younger.

We actually started doing a radio show on like, you know, [00:10:00] those, you know, like a tape deck and started recording ourselves and we'd pretend to be like DJs and like talk because for her personality, it was all about having fun. Um, and I think that's true too, when you're interacting with your family, like, start realizing like, okay, this per sibling is like this, but this sibling is like this.

And instead of trying to change them, you know, you just got to go with it, you know, like, recognize it for the strengths and weaknesses that they are. 

Brad Minus: Oh my god, it's amazing you mentioned that. Oh my god. So, when I was a kid, for like three years, and I don't know what it was in my brain, but for the, for three years, I kept asking my parents for Christmas, and for Hanukkah, I wanted a tape recorder.

A cassette tape recorder. Oh, I wanted one. So me already so bad. I was like, I can't wait. And then finally, finally, my dad like gave me this, uh, you know, he gave me this brand new taper deck. And it was, you know, the, the big giant, um, uh, rec, rec, uh, rec, uh, rectangle, you know, and it had the. I had the big giant buttons that you had to like force [00:11:00] down and yeah, exactly.

And I was so excited to get that made all kinds of sound effects. I played radio show. I sang into it. I mean, I carried it wherever. And then the following year I was like, well, I really love that, but it's so big to carry around. Can you give me one of those really tiny ones? And then I started carrying, and then I started carrying it around with me.

I just make, like I said, I'd hear a sound effect and I'd like tape it. And then, you know, something would pop up and I'd be like talking into it. And, you know, obviously as a kid, you know, my parents would be talking and I'd slide it underneath the door and, you know, listen to it later. So that's funny that you were doing, you're doing a radio show with your sister.

That's awesome. Um, and it 

Eric Gee: shows to you like, you know, you knew at an early age, or at least felt at an early age, like, this is something that I love doing, you know, like, this is a passion of mine and look where it took you now, right? It's like, really cool. And I 

Brad Minus: appreciate that. Um, what about your, what your parents do, 

Eric Gee: you know, my, my father was a systems analyst, which [00:12:00] I say that.

And it's like, what the heck is a systems analyst? Really? It's just an intermediary intermediary between the people creating the software engineers and the users. Right. Which studying personality there, you start to realize the software engineers are generally a different personality type from the users.

So as a systems analyst, it was my job, my dad's job to like explain this to these people and be able to connect to both of them at a certain level. And actually he was quite good at that, even though for the most part, he was definitely someone who was always more about following his actual fun interests.

Um, and that really had a huge impact on me because he was definitely of the personality type where he would just. Tell me as a kid, like, Hey, don't like worry about what people think. Cause at the end of the day, no one cares anyway, you know? So you gotta do what you want to do, you know, as opposed to like trying to assimilate or fit into what everyone is telling you.

Um, which is funny because my mom was a high school principal, which is the exact thing that principals tell you to do is like, no, do what the kids are doing. So you don't get in trouble. Right? So that was a bit of a conflict already right there. And I'm thankful growing up that my [00:13:00] mom actually deferred to my dad in that regard, and she let him.

Say those things maybe because she knew in her mind that as kids, my brother, my sister and I, we were almost always going to follow our father because whenever he gave us, he told us something to do. He always had like a logical reason behind it. And for us as kids, we're like, okay, that makes sense. We're going to do that because you've convinced us.

He never said like, Hey, do this because I'm your dad. I'm telling you to do that. And at least for our personality types, I think that worked a lot better, which is why personality typing is so helpful for parents too, because, you know, some kids are going to follow authority and they're going to like that.

It's going to make them feel safe. Yeah. But half the kids are not, and you want to have a good relationship, obviously, with your children. So if you don't want to piss them off enough, like it's good to figure out what they are, so you can kind of adjust, right? 

Brad Minus: Makes sense. All right. So what type of animal was your dad?

Eric Gee: You know, so he would be called a chimpanzee. It's a chimpanzee personality type. And the biggest, I would say that's like, um, [00:14:00] they're subversive because they like to tell a lot of jokes, do a lot of pranks. Um, information is a big thing for them. They are always into reason, logic and figuring out the reason why things happen and breaking that down.

But they're also going to be the type to not necessarily take that too seriously, um, in the general scheme of things because authority is not something that they particularly respect. Which is odd because my mom as a school principal, they rule generally by authority. So once again, I don't know what's going on there psychologically, but, um, that was the case there.

So for him, he was all about making life fun, but also he'd always just tell us, Hey, like, I will support you in anything you want to do, but you better like life is not easy. So if you're really interested in something, go for it, but if you don't go for it, then you're just being lazy, you know, and that's not a good excuse.

So, um, yeah, that would be a good description of a chimpanzee. Like, think like, um, Tony Stark. I think 20. Like Ironman. Yeah. That's a great archetypal. Fictional chimpanzee. Interesting. Um, you know, he's joking. Yeah. He, he's all about information. He does research, he [00:15:00] experiments, you know, that kind of thing 

Brad Minus: without the suit.

Who are you? Uh, a philanthropist, billionaire, uh, 

Eric Gee: genius. . That's, that, that is exactly what a chimpanzee, they're a little cocky. Their weaknesses, obviously every type has weaknesses. Right. And they're. Their weaknesses, they can be a bit arrogant. My dad was, could be a bit arrogant. He definitely had a very high respect for his own intelligence level.

So 

Brad Minus: interesting. Um, and so that, would that make your mom a shark too? 

Eric Gee: No, you know, so I know I'm saying all these random animals, but my mom was a stag and that's, um, you know, so not to get all wonky with this, but you know, I, I split people up into four major packs. of people. And then within those four packs, there are four animals.

Okay. So four times four. So there's 16, right? So if you're within a specific pack, then you're going to get along probably better understand the animal personality types within that pack more than you might. This 1. Um, so my mom would be part of the gatherer pack and they're the type that would [00:16:00] respect safety and security.

They would really that's their number 1 value. And so that makes sense. She's a school principal. What's a school principal's job to make sure the kids are safe, the school's working right? They're learning. They're learning about like communal values. She wasn't particularly big into like, you don't have to be smart that you don't as a kid.

She wasn't telling us. Oh, you guys have the best tops kids in the class. She was more like, hey, behave and like, make sure you're not screaming over your teachers and you're making sure that everything's like, fine. And you've become fine upstanding citizens. And that's kind of what a stags like, they're just like, I don't.

I just want my kids to be able to take care of themselves and not mess up society. That's my goal. You know, which is funny because it's chimpanzees goals. I just want my kids to be smart and make society hurt a little bit and maybe cause a little chaos, you know, to make it better. Um, so it's just funny to have those two competing.

I always think of the show house. If anyone's familiar, yeah, no 

Brad Minus: loved house 

Eric Gee: house as a chimpanzee and Cuddy is a stag, and you can see that dynamic, you know, where house is like [00:17:00] poking fun, making fun of her and like, just kind of making her life a living hell because all she wants is order in her hospital.

And he is not giving that. But in fairness to cutty, she's really strong. She does not put up with his crap. She's able to see through a lot of that. And at the end of the day, she's strong enough to understand that he is better than her in a lot of things. And she will defer to him when it matters most when it comes to diagnostics.

Right? But if it comes to, like, actually keeping the hospital together, that's her bag. And, you know, and it's, that's what stags are really good at is they're like, look, this is what I'm good at. I'll stick to that. I'm not going to, like, overstep my bounds. Um, so anyway, yeah, so that was my rental dynamic. So 

Brad Minus: you're so like CEOs and like people in the sweet suite as far as that.

We might mostly always be in the gatherers side. Do you think? 

Eric Gee: Yeah, you know, it's, it's interesting. A lot of them, a large percentage are gatherers. Um, and then there are, there's one person there's, so there's another pack called the Smiths and within that [00:18:00] pack, there are two animals and I, one of them is called the killer whale.

And I always call them the CEO personality. They don't make up the majority of CEOs, but for their percentage in the population, they only make about 2, 3 percent of the population. They probably make up like a 3rd of CEOs. So they're kind of like, um, also large and in charge, but since their strength is more strategy, they actually make better CEOs probably than a stag or gather because gather skills tend to be fit with logistics, right?

Like. Make keeping feel keeping things organized, making sure like George Washington was a stag, right? So he's all about logistics and making sure you have the supplies. Okay, but let's say you listen to this grant was a killer whale. He's about strategy. How are we going to get our objective, reach our objective?

What's our major plan? You know, and that's, that's, that's. Slight difference, but pretty big when you 

Brad Minus: actually come to meet them. Okay. That's all right. So that's, so I'm going to, I want to walk into this now because I'm so excited. And I, you got me like really rocking and rolling here in my head. So the gatherers logistics organization.

So, you [00:19:00] know, um, what, what's her, what's her name? The, the, the, uh, Passionate, uh, holding things to yourself. Oh, you feel something, then put it away. And if you don't throw it out, Marie Curry, Mary. Oh, she's got to be a gatherer. 

Eric Gee: Actually, no, because you know, but this is how you know, be a gatherer. If they were a gatherer, if she was a gatherer, what she would say is, keep it if it's useful, right?

Or keep it if it like, has like some practical value. But she never says that she says keep it if it feels like what does she what's her line? Sparks? Oh, sparks love. Yeah, 

Brad Minus: passion or something. 

Eric Gee: So, so funny enough, she's actually a hunter. Because hunters, their number one value is excitement, like visceral excitement.

How does this make you feel like, like they love going on roller coasters, not to say that other types don't, but, you know, a hunter would say like, Yeah, I love going on roller coasters because they make me feel like I might die. I know I'm not going to die, but I sure do feel like I might. [00:20:00] And that is exciting to me because there's a certain level of danger and it makes my body feel like, you know, it stimulates my adrenaline versus other types.

Like a gatherer might be like, why do I want to be on a roller coaster and be thrown around? Like, that makes me feel unsafe. And that's exactly how I don't want to feel. And you can see how those are like compete right together. Yes. Um, Marie Kondo actually is like a shark. So she's very, she has the same personality type as my sister.

They're very precise. They are about like how something makes you feel, but they tend to have very clean environments. Because they're so, um, stark with what their feelings are like, no, I like this, this makes me feel good. This I don't like it's out here like very quickly. There's like, Nope, Nope, Nope. Nope.

So you, but yeah, 

Brad Minus: so the people that that are organized, but yet they're so organ, they're organized to way to a point where they feel it makes them feel a certain way, you know, medicines lined up a certain way and they're, and they're, you know, In their medicine cabinet, you know, everything's lined up, you know, everything where that goes, [00:21:00] um, because of the way it makes them feel versus a gatherer might put them in a certain way, alphabetical or in a certain way, because it makes sense, logical.

Eric Gee: Right. Like I used to have a little test when I would have my students in my office. So my books, strangely enough, my books were organized on my shelf. By color. And then that's like, what? Like by color. And it wasn't my idea. It was a hunter friend of mine. And she was like, I'm going to organize your books.

And I was like, Oh, you're going to organize them by like topic or alphabetically. Like, I don't know. Those are the two thoughts I might have. And she's like, no, I'm going to organize them by color. And so she put them like color coded and it was a test with my students because the hunter students often notice they would come in and go.

Oh, your books are organized by color because that's something that they see, you know, they immediately get that excited. They're like, oh, that's kind of fun versus. Yeah, you're right. A gather would be more about like, what's the, like, let's do it alphabetically because that's a structure that I can understand.

And it's really easy to understand. And, you know, it's certain and we can find it. But, um. [00:22:00] And yeah, so I just got into the habit of like, what color book was that again? Oh, yellow. Okay, yellow. And it was actually pretty fast for me to find books after I started seeing the world that way. I, myself, am not a hunter.

So I had to like adjust a little bit to that. Um, but it was fun. 

Brad Minus: Yeah, so let's, so, so, okay. So we've got The Gatherers, Logical. Uh, they like, you know, logistics, um, organized, but organized with a little, uh, logical reasoning hunters. 

Eric Gee: I would say more. Sorry. I would say more. They emphasize safety and security.

So they're organized with a sense of caution because logic. I kind of think of as like. Cold and not necessarily personal, but gatherers are actually are very personal. Like they're the, they're so communal, you know, they love the idea of community in their mind. They're organizing things because they want to keep people together and they want to keep society safe.

Brad Minus: Okay. 

Eric Gee: Um, 

Brad Minus: yeah. So 

Eric Gee: would most. Most gatherers would be extroverts or, you know, it's funny, I'm just [00:23:00] so here's an interesting thing. Sorry if I'm getting really, no, no, it's great. No, this is amazing. Yeah, with extroversion introversion. I'm not a huge fan of this with this reason, about half the population are gatherers, right?

And so originally, when young came up with the idea of extroversion, introversion, obviously, he's observing people. He's testing people. Of course, he's asking for volunteers to like, for studies. Gatherers love to volunteer for things. Because in their mind, they're like, oh, I want to do my duty to society.

And this makes me feel good. So you're going to find them in a lot of nonprofits. You're going to find them helping out in a lot of different ways. So, of course, they would volunteer for a study. So not only do they make up half the population, they make up probably a larger percentage of that in terms of studies.

So I think when young was doing that, he saw that, Oh, extroversion, introversion, these people have more energy on the outside. These people have less energy. They're more internal, right? Or inward, but it only works with gathers. If you take like hunters or some of the other packs, like shamans and smiths, the dichotomy doesn't work that way.

It doesn't work based on the [00:24:00] energy that you project versus the energy that you don't, you know, and that's kind of the difference between my methodology and like, the ones that came before it, like MBTI or Myers Briggs is I, you know, De emphasize extroversion and introversion, because I don't think, at least in my experience, observing kids, it doesn't necessarily manifest itself that way.

As I said it, 

Brad Minus: I was thinking, I was like, alright, I just said extrovert, but you said a word that actually made more sense, communal. So we would look at it being okay. There might be typically definition of extrovert, but within their community, probably not with outside 

Eric Gee: the community, right? Like it's, that's their goal.

So stags are definitely going to appear like the typical extrovert because stags are confident. They're tough. They're, uh, strong, you know, and generally outwardly, I mean, and they definitely think that they're right. Most of the time we think of Cuddy, right? She's like, this is how you do things. I'm right.

That's the way I live is right. So I'm going to be like this, this, this, this. Right. [00:25:00] But you might have a bear. A bear is another type of gatherer. Um, so they also believe in community and they love things together, but they, they don't necessarily do it in that way. So a famous bear might be like Superman.

Superman is not communal. He, you know, he's to himself and he wants to protect the people he loves, but he's not someone who's out there. He's definitely not someone who's confident in telling people how things should be. He's definitely more of a reactor, you know, and I always say that with bears, they might, right.

appear. They're the people because they're gatherers, they want to be around people. So they like being around people, but they might be quiet around them, right? They're still going to want to go to all the parties, but they might not spend that much time there. Or they might be very quiet and they might only converse with one person.

Um, so that's why I'm like, so are they extroverted or introverted? Right? I feel like that's why it's kind of simplistic sometimes talk about that because it's like, yeah, they do want to go out and see people and get people's energy, but they might not be very vocal. Got it. So 

Brad Minus: good. Oh yeah. So Jubilee. Who extracts power from [00:26:00] Jubilee from X Men.

She probably, she would extract power from everybody else. She would get, yeah. And she uses it for her, uh, 

Eric Gee: you know, Jubilee is, uh, Jubilee is a hunter. She but she's a hunter. She's a peacock. So it was just funny because I mean, she's making fireworks. She's clearly like, look at me. I got fireworks because hunters are gain their energy from visceral excitement.

Right? So it's funny enough. She's literally symbolically absorbing that energy and then using it to like, demonstrate, which is something that peacocks love to do. They're like, Gifted performers and showmen. So they just like, you know, where'd you get a hunter like Wolverine who actually literally is a hunter, right?

But Wolverine would be an example of shark. You know, he's very narrow focus. He's kind of reckless his big weakness, of course, is he doesn't always see the big picture, but he's like, no, give me a target. And I will like, I will not stop until I have taken that target down. You know, and that's a very typical shark move.

Brad Minus: Okay, so I was, I'm [00:27:00] here I am, I'm listening to you trying to get it on my own, and I'm not getting it. So I'm going to ask you to do it. So adjectives of gatherers, what I've gotten as far as what you were saying is big picture, um, communal, and, uh, logical. Just, just overall, 

Eric Gee: just overall. I would say that this is going to be the worst description.

I mean, they're going to think it's the worst description of a gather, but I always describe them as gatherers live in a bubble. They live in a bubble. Now, that bubble can be very small or it can be very big because they want things to be safe and bubbles are really safe. Right? So the problem with the gather is if you get them too much to, to like change from that bubble, you're popping it and then it explodes and then you're not safe.

Right? So you have to expand. So a gatherer's focus is they're practical, they're communal, and they want everything to be safe and organized and structured. Because when things are safe, organized, and structured, then it fits that idea of like, like that a [00:28:00] community, a safe community, right? A secure community.

And they like structure and tradition. Tradition is a good way to describe them too. Like, they love tradition. Um, because in their mind, it's the safest bet, right? They're like, well, this worked before. So why don't we do with what worked before? Like, as opposed to like trying to do all these different things, you know?

So that's the only reason why I would say, hesitate to say logical. I think gatherers, if you ask them, they'd say they're logical, but I don't necessarily think they are, because I feel like logic is something removed from people, right? Like logic can help you make very difficult choices based on statistics and numbers that I don't think a gatherer might do.

Um, if that makes any sense. 

Brad Minus: Okay. Yeah. No, it doesn't make sense. Okay. So then let's talk about the adjectives for hunters. 

Eric Gee: Uh, hunters would be visceral, uh, excitement oriented. Um, spontaneous would be a good one. Uh, tool users. They're really great with tools. Um, and very flexible. [00:29:00] So they're the type of person, if you think of like Bert and Ernie, that's a good comparison.

That's a great one. Bert is a gatherer, obviously. And Ernie is like, and it sucks because everyone's like, no one likes Bert and gatherers always feel that way. But no one likes me, but I always say, Hey, you know what? Gatherers make up 50 percent of the population. So even though pop culture doesn't make you particularly exciting, you guys are the ones who basically.

Are the foundation of our society and kind of creating a little bit of that. So, you know, just, you know, the majority. So be happy 

Brad Minus: with that. Okay. So we talked a lot about gatherers and hunters. Let's talk about shamans. 

Eric Gee: Okay. And so, and that makes sense because gatherers make up half the population, hunters make up a third.

So that leaves like a very small percentage for shamans and Smith. Shamans seek self knowledge. So that's their goal. So, whereas the others, one, one's visceral excitement. One's when safety and security shamans, all they want to do is they want to learn about themselves. And other people and also ideally help those other people discover who they truly are and themselves.

Right. And [00:30:00] so it's really difficult because you know how they talk about midlife crises. People have a midlife crisis. I'm always like shamans don't have a midlife crisis because their whole life is a crisis, right? They spend their whole life going. Wait, is this who I am? I don't know. Is this one? Am I doing the right thing?

I might not be doing the right thing. It's just for me. Like, and they spend their whole life doing that. The benefit is when it comes to midlife, there will be the most likely to actually Truly be connected with who they are, because they've been working on it for so long versus you might get like, maybe a gather who's had a very safe and secure kind of, um, path and a very linear approach, but by the time they get to 40, they might be thinking, wait a minute, did I actually really even think about whether I like this or not?

Um, and so I, I work with a few 40 year old clients and yeah, that's constantly where they're at, where there's like, I didn't even think about whether I like my job and now I realize I hate it. So, yeah, that would be the small mind type for sure. They, they're constantly navel gazing and thinking about what this means to them as a person.

So they love personality types. They love the idea of personality types because it helps them understand themselves better. Number one. And number two, it helps [00:31:00] them understand the 

Brad Minus: people in their life. By the time they get to middle age, they're self actualized. They know exactly who they are. Ideally, 

Eric Gee: they've gone through a lot of pain, but generally, yeah, they've, they've gone through the pain early.

So they're the people who go through the pain earlier, and then when they're older, they actually kind of appear more confident, right? Because they're like, yeah, I've gone through this, like, it's no biggie now, you know? Um, but yeah, that would be, that would be a good description of the shamans. 

Brad Minus: Okay, so this is going to sound weird, because it's just, but it's just what I see.

And I'm wondering if you might agree with me, you probably won't. Do you think Elon Musk might be a shaman?

Eric Gee: No, but he, I can see why you might think that, but he's actually very clever. He appears very close to a specific shaman, and he's a smith. He's a smith. And maybe if I describe what he is Actually, Elon Musk is a chimpanzee. I didn't mention it before, as I was describing my father. But he's actually a chimpanzee, which [00:32:00] they seek information.

And I feel like he's constantly seeking new information, which enables him to do a lot of stuff, right? Like he constantly take risks. He's experimenting. He's, you know, obviously, a Tesla, like not the company, but Nikola Tesla was a chimpanzee. So it makes sense that Elon Musk would really idolize him and name his company Tesla.

Um, in the book, I have this, like, Comparison between Edison and Tesla, because they're both inventors and they're both doing very similar things. And they worked together. They did. Yeah. And then within their critique of each other, you see how they're one is a chimpanzee and the other is a killer whale.

So Edison would be the CEO type. So he is a Smith, just like, um, Tesla. So they do fit under the same pack. So they both are seeking information. So they're both obviously going to identify quite a bit with each other, but because they're different animal types. Their, their method of getting that information will be very different and in their arguments and in the way that Edison saw Tesla and Tesla saw Edison, it's kind of funny because that's [00:33:00] exactly how our killer whale would critique a chimpanzee and vice versa, you know, like.

Edison's always just like Tesla. He's just like got his head in the clouds. He's not very pragmatic. Like, you know, in order to get your technology forward, you have to establish a structure and have a structural business advantage. So let's get this. And I will have this advantage and everything's going to be DC.

Even if AC makes more sense, everything's gonna be DC because I have put in the work to create this. Disuse my strategic ability to control things because killer whales are all about control chimpanzees, like Musk and Tesla are not, they don't care about control. They're subversive. Right. They want to like throw stuff up and let it explode.

Right. So in their mind, you know, Tesla used to criticize Edison because he'd like, he he's worked so hard and he's so diligent for where all you had to do is like think creatively and he would have gotten the solution like that, you know? So it's just funny to see the difference in them, you know? 

Brad Minus: Well, it's just, and in there.

In their inventions, right? So direct current, one way, not bilateral, straight, go [00:34:00] from one point to the other, alternating, being able to go in different directions, describes both of their, their personality types, just like you mentioned, right? Addison had one way to do it. He went through it direct. Tesla was like, no, he can go around and above and backwards and forwards and you know, um, and he just go around.

So that makes total sense. It makes complete sense now why they, why they butted heads on alternating and direct current. That's funny. That's so 

Eric Gee: funny. I never thought about that way. I should have, I should have put it down in the book. Jeez. Like I'd all tapped on that. I didn't think of the symbolism of that, but yeah, that's perfect.

Brad Minus: Yeah, I just think that's, that's, that's amazing. So we have gatherers, hunters, shamans, and smiths. And, uh, interesting that. I least was on the, on the wavelength as far as Elon Musk goes as, as, as being close, not a shaman, but a Smith and that makes, makes perfect sense. Um, I think the guy's great. I think he's amazing.

And especially like what you said is like, let him like, they're [00:35:00] willing to like, let it go and let it all blow up. And that, that quote that he mentioned when he was, when people were talking to him about, well, you know what, uh, you're just going to lose all your advertising. I'm like, so? Then let them, let them go.

I don't need them. I don't need their money. Let them go. I just loved that. 

Eric Gee: Right. And if it was, if it was a killer whale, it would be totally different right because they, they are the CEO type. I mean, I know he's technically a CEO, but he probably has a mentality that's not typical. Like you wouldn't see a Tim cook do that ever.

Right. Right. And that's the difference in their personality, but it's cool because that kind of let it go attitude has enabled him to be successful in his particular field. Like if he was in like a logistics field. Like if his company was a logistics company, probably wouldn't do so well. Right. But it's not, it's a tech company and with tech, you need innovation.

And for innovation, you need to build something and then tear it all down and build something else. And then tear that all down and build something else and just keep, you know, staggering up. That shows, you know, that's amazing. How did you come up with all [00:36:00] this? You know, MBTI first, right. And MBTI has like different, MBTI also has 16 types.

So a lot of people will read mine and go like, Oh, it's the same thing. But then when you actually read the book, it's like the way that you're diagnosing people is so different. Cause obviously I don't believe in extroversion introversion in that way. And MBTI is always about like, you're either extroverted or introverted, you know, and even something like I use like Musk as an example, like he would be a chimpanzee.

And, um, in MBTI terms, that would be an extroverted kind. Right. And then the introverted version would be someone like Einstein. Right. But the way I divide them isn't like whether Elon Musk is more talkative versus Einstein being more shy or quiet or low energy. It's more how they grasp the world, right?

Because I saw that with my students, right? Like, if you're a Smith and your number one priority is information, then, of course, that's going to determine the differences between the Smiths. And since both chimpanzees and the introverted version would be the owl, Both of them [00:37:00] want information, but it's how they process it that is the difference, right?

Chimpanzees process their information by experimenting. Like they, okay, this is my theory. This is my idea. I'm going to create an invention or do an experiment. See if it works. If it blows up in my face, I have new information and I'm going to do a different one that adjusts to that. Right? You think of like house, right?

House is a chimpanzee. He's constantly like, I don't know, like, let's see, let's give them this thing. And maybe if it makes them sick, we'll know, at least we'll know. Right? And then we can change it, but we're not going to know unless we do it. Right? Whereas an owl, they process their information internally in their mind.

So they would be more observant. They will calculate in their head, just like Einstein, right? Einstein was a scientist who never had a lab, right? He did all the calculations theoretically had, um, and there's a lot of strength to that as well, right? There's just 2 different personality types, you know, and that's the distinction.

Brad Minus: That's that's amazing. So I love that. I love that idea. So I will. Being more, okay, we're going to think about it. We're going to put it on paper, then we're going to [00:38:00] experiment and chimpanzee is trial and error. Um, no, we're going to put these two together. If it works great. If not, we'll try something else.

So, um, yeah, I would disagree as far as, uh, extrovert and introvert on, um, Musk, I think he's an extrovert because he needs to be not because he wants to be. I think, I believe. From what I've read and what I've seen of his interviews and everything else, I truly believe he is more at home either in his office or in the lab.

Um, and I think he only does this because he knows this, he's the CEO of Axe, he's the CEO of Tesla, and he, you know, and the founder of Tesla and stuff, and he has to be there. Um, in order to make this, yeah. 

Eric Gee: No, I a hundred percent agree. That's why that's, I, that's why I use it as an example of why I don't believe in extroversion introversion.

Like if you do MBTI, people would say, Oh, he's an extrovert, but I always say, just like Tony Stark. Yeah. He's talkative and stuff and he jokes around, but like, just like you said, if you ask them, where do you want to be most of all, 100 percent [00:39:00] they're going to say in a lab because that's where they're experimenting.

And that's like how they engage with the world, right. Is in the lab. I mean, they're both pretty nerdy, you know, I mean, Smith's are going to be kind of nerdy already, like nerdy in a good way. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but you know, they're not, they're not the most socially adept people. Sometimes, you know, I worked with a lot of software engineers when I used to like help my friends or Hulu team and like understanding personality and.

Software engineers are not always the best at like, you know, reading people and socially I, I get 

Brad Minus: it. So I, so I coach, uh, as a, as my side hustle. This is something is a passion. My. Outside job, the job that actually makes money is I'm a, um, I'm a senior IT project and program manager. Um, and so I've been around, so I help manage those, those, um, the, uh, developers.

So I've been around them a lot. Very, very, like, um, bear, very, um, you know, straightforward and going at, or an owl, like a lot of [00:40:00] owls. Um, they'll sit there and, I mean, it's all theory, like code. Yeah, a lot, I would say it's a lot of owls. Some, some chimpanzees, but mostly owls. Um, and they, where they think about it, and then they code it, and it works.

And then some of them will write down code, fix it later. You know, so, um, I would, I would probably move it on, in that direction, if I thought. Is that what you think, as far as the people that you've met, as far as your brother's concerned? 

Eric Gee: Yeah, you know, my brother's a little different, but you're going to get, he's a gatherer, but you're going to get a lot of gatherers in a lot of positions just because by nature, they're half the population.

But yeah, the interesting thing I found also, yeah, a lot of owls, a lot of chimpanzees, a lot of spiders. I didn't mention spiders, but they're another smith. Um, but the funny thing is even within that industry, I believe there's something called the knock. I might be doing that. No, no, no, no network. My center.

Yeah. Yeah. And those are the hunters. If you're going to find hunters in that industry, they will be the hunters because they're like 24, seven. They're like SWAT team firefighter types, right? We're like, okay, we're going to get in and fix the situation. [00:41:00] They're objective, they're targeted, but then they also want free time to play when they're not on the clock.

Right. And that's very much like what hunters, like hunters, like really a flexible schedule where they're just like, Hey, I will work hard, extremely hard for a specific period of time. As long as I get to play the rest of the time that I'm not working in, you know? And so I think of the knock as being the hunters of that.

Sector, but for the most part, you're right. Like yeah, owls, you're gonna get a lot of smiths. 

Brad Minus: Yeah, for sure. They were. And they were amazing. So, ah, slowly starting to get this, slowly starting to get, I'm gonna read, I, I'm, now I'm like to read the book. I need to read the book and I wish I would've done it beforehand.

Um, and I probably would've if it wasn't for a hurricane. Um, that's good. Um, but no, I'm super, uh, super excited to do that. So, um, tell me about how you, uh, let's, let's go back to the second. So tell me about how you started your education company. 

Eric Gee: So the funny thing is I was working as a tutor for another company.

Um, and me being [00:42:00] like, so I'm a shaman. So like shamans and I'm a shaman is very based on like principle. Shamans can be split up into people, uh, people, prioritizers and principle prioritizers. I was just one that's a principle prioritizer and I was working for a company. I thought they were kind of unethical.

So of course I'm like, well, I don't believe in this. Um, so I'm going to start my own company with principles that I believe in. And one of those major principles, of course, this will come as no surprise. It's. Like seeing kids at an individual level and seeing their best opportunity for growth within themselves and focusing on that.

And I mean, unfortunately, it's not unfortunate, but a lot of teachers, as you would imagine, are gatherers, right? Because teachers, teachers, main job is to make sure that a kid has a safe space, um, that they can learn a secure curriculum. That's like, tried and true, you know, so that you're not gonna take any chances, really.

Um, and so a lot of my teachers were gatherers, and so when I hired them, I started my own company. I wanted to really teach them how to interact with their students better in terms of [00:43:00] reading their student, not letting their own bias towards safety and security impact whether, because half the time they're going to get a student who's not a gatherer, right?

So how do you deal with that? Are you going to deal with it in a way? That is helpful for the student. I say, like, if you get a hunter student, you can never tell them to be careful. And that's like probably this example I always use because gather the first thing they're going to say to a hunter when they're taking a chance, like maybe, like playing on the monkey bars, they're going to be like, be careful.

And you can't tell them that because hunters, their strength comes from their ability to take risk and assess risk quickly. Right. And as a kid, that's where you learn it on the monkey bars, on the swings, doing cartwheels. You know, they're the kids who come back from summer vacation. Maybe they have a broken arm, you know, because they tried something right.

But if they don't try that and they, when the stakes are low, when they're an adult and the stakes are higher, they're not going to be good at that. So when you tell them, be careful, it takes that away from them, that power away from them, because you're telling them who they are and where they get their strength from [00:44:00] is not right.

So I always tell my teachers, tell them to concentrate or tell them to focus, because essentially you're saying the same thing. You're basically saying, hey, you're going to swing on those monkey bars like that. You got to pay attention and focus, but a hunter will read that totally differently. They'll read it as like, okay, you're saying it's okay for me to take chances.

But when I do, I have to be like, I got to take it seriously. And I got to really focus. And it's like that, like in my experience with kids who are hunters and when their teachers tell them that they immediately do better in school because they're, they're feeling like they're being seen, you know, sorry, that was a long story.

No, don't be sorry. 

Brad Minus: That's perfect. I, like, I just think that when people start listening to this episode, they're going to be start like giving themselves. Maybe an idea of what they might be. And they're like, Oh, well, then how would you deal with that? Then hopefully they'll they'll actually want to dig in, they'll grab the book, they'll read it, and then they'll be actually able to focus a little bit better.

And it might give them that nugget that I always tell, but which is the reason for this podcast in the first place is to talk [00:45:00] to people like you, who have, I wouldn't call it for you, you're the only person that I wanted to bring because I was just so excited about your book and about what you represent.

Your So called adversity basically was the fact that you didn't finish things you had no follow through and you didn't finish things and you figured that out by coming up with the ability to, you know, put yourself into a personality type, and then find a way for you to actually follow through using your personality type.

That's a little bit, that's a little bit less dramatic than some of my other people that have like, you know, we're We're, you know, we're addicted to drugs, people that had major accidents and, you know, lost their legs and that type of thing. But I think this is just as important. Because what I say is that what I want everybody to come up with is one nugget of information.

One nugget that you can take away, act on, and if it works, great. If it doesn't, you've learned [00:46:00] something and you can do the opposite or you can find something around that or you listen to the next episode and get another nugget. Either way. So, um, So, but that's, that's what I want people to take away from that.

And I think this is extremely important because of knowing yourself and the way you learn, the way you talk, the way you are is going to give you the ability to use that and develop a technique that works for you might not work for anybody else. 

Eric Gee: Right. And growing up, like I would say that, yeah, the biggest adversity for me was not only that, but just feeling like a weirdo, right?

Like if you have different values than you're being told from your teachers. And this is, I work with a lot of students who actually are shamans. So shamans have this feeling oftentimes where they grow up and they're like, I'm such a weirdo. But Smith's also had that feeling, but they react to it differently.

Smith's are like, I'm such a weirdo. So screw those people. I'm just going to do what I do, you know? Cause they're going to see, right. So they get a chip on their shoulder that way, but shamans are like, Oh, maybe I should assimilate. And [00:47:00] so a lot of their life is that conflict between wanting to simulate, but not really feeling like they fit in.

Um, and my shaman type is one that appears to be fine on the outside because I joke around a lot and I'm pretty laid back, but inside, I still felt that kind of tension. Um, and I work with a lot of, and I just want to let them know, and people who are listening and reading the book to know, like, even though your values are different than people, you're okay, you know, like you can find a better way, you don't have to like.

You know, be depressed or feel like you don't belong in our society because our society needs you as well. Everyone's needed in a certain way. So, you know, there's hope. Like 

Brad Minus: nice. And the, the company that you started, but you still have, is this, is this Utopia? 

Eric Gee: Yeah. The Utopia projects. Um, it's part of like my life coaching and my, I'd also do writing coaching.

Cause like I put them hand in hand, 

Brad Minus: but. Okay. So, so this is not the, the education company that you started. 

Eric Gee: No. So the education company, I actually stopped doing [00:48:00] that funny enough. And I mean, this is a long story. It should be, but like I, my background is in screenwriting, that's where I went to school for, and I decided to shut up the education company to kind of pursue writing.

And I was writing scripts and pilots and trying to get them sold, which is very difficult here, uh, or difficult anywhere, but especially in LA. And, um, A friend of mine, we were talking, I got to talking at this bar with other writers and people got really into the animals, like my personality methodology and my friend was like, Hey, you should like write a book on this.

I was like, Oh, no, I'm going to keep writing my pilots, you know, and, uh, then she took the ideas and put it into an episode for the TV that she wrote on. Um, it's on the show called mythic quest and Apple TV, and she put them in there and I was like, Oh, shoot, like if you put it in there and it was good enough to like go in there, then I probably should pitch this as a book and write it.

And that's where it got started. And I, I, I did it and, you know, I was able to get an agent and publisher and yeah, here we are now. So long story short, you know, that's, that's how it came about. 

Brad Minus: Oh, so you've published this, you publish this [00:49:00] traditionally. 

Eric Gee: Yes. Yes. Yes. I used a traditional publisher, uh, you know, through my agent.

That's outstanding. 

Brad Minus: So it's, you know what, it's just so weird because I, listen, I. Almost every single one of my episodes has got a, I've got an author that wrote a book and most of them is published. So it's, oh yeah, there's nothing wrong with that, but yeah, I went the other route. No, but it's much harder, you know, it's much harder on the traditional side.

Um, so I think that's, so that, that makes the things a little bit greater. Cause I mean, I didn't know this and I just, I just started doing it as a, as a, as a side hustle is like, I started publishing coloring books for kids. Oh, oh, yeah, I just put but it's just as a side hustle just to catch, you know Just a little bit of something when people when somebody's looking for a certain coloring book They put it into amazon.

It shows up. They they um, they get it sent to their house right through kdp But it did cost me a damn thing to to put it together I just I just picked out some I you know I got some drawings and I put them all together and put it on a coloring [00:50:00] book and then I put it through kdp and It gets over to amazon and it's done on demand, you know, so when somebody orders the book it's printed Say again 

Eric Gee: No, I said, that's the beauty of Amazon.

It's just makes things so much easier, right? Where 

Brad Minus: you just do that. 

Eric Gee: And yeah, let's just 

Brad Minus: like put it out. Right, exactly. But, but, but you went the actual route, get an agent, find a publisher that will actually look at and go, wait, this will make money, give you an advance. You finished writing the book. You fight, you write the book.

They, they edit it, send it out. You do. And then, you know, when, when, when your books cover the advance, then you start getting royalties on it. Is that my, is that, is that about the right way? Yeah, no, that's no, that's exactly that's that's exactly the 

Eric Gee: right. 

Brad Minus: Yeah. So I think so I think that's much harder.

Right? Um, so I think that's amazing. Um, so that's great. Yeah. Oh, and by the way, mythic quest. Yeah. Love that show. Um, and now I'm going to have to figure out which episode that was because I'm going to have to 

Eric Gee: you'll know it's in the 2nd season. I will say my friend Katie is. Awesome. And great. And I do feel like, well, [00:51:00] did you see both seasons of mythic 

Brad Minus: quest?

I was, I think I ended at, like, the 2nd episode of mythic quest before I got involved with something else because I'm like you, I can't, I can't finish up something. So, um, 

Eric Gee: yeah, I was my friend Katie. She wrote 1 episode in season 1, 1 episode in season 2. Um, and in season 2, it's the 1 that there is the 1 that she wrote in season 2, but her season 1 episode is, um, I think the best episode I've been told, cause I've only seen one episode of mythic quest, but I've been told that her season one episode was the best episode in the quest history.

So 

Brad Minus: the concept is brilliant. The actual concept of the show is absolutely brilliant. Um, so just the idea of this, you know, of this, uh, this, this gaming company, you know what I mean? And, uh, what goes on inside it and the, and the, the crazy CEO that wants it. Oh my God. It's so funny. It's just because it's just, it's.

You could see that it could be very, very close to being, you know, um, realistic. Oh, I'm sure 

Eric Gee: they did a lot of research [00:52:00] on that. Yeah, that is absolutely. I guess it's a lot like the writer's room. The writer's room and, uh, the, the program, I mean, it's very similar. You have some socially awkward people. We were trying to have a similar objective, but don't always work together, but they're trying to make something together.

You know, that's creative. 

Brad Minus: Yeah. Yeah. I think, but I, I just absolutely think that's brilliant. So, um, so have you gotten, uh, as far as your screenwriting career goes, have you gotten anything published, um, or, or, or actually made? 

Eric Gee: No, you know, like that's, that's a hard business. I'll say like, you know, I'm out here in LA and I mean, I'm from LA.

So it's not like I didn't move out here. Um, like some people do, which is amazing. Um, but yeah, I mean, it's one of those things where you just keep trying. Like for me, it's all like, like you said, with the marathon race, it's all about the process, right? It's like the process of writing something. Like for me, I just wanted to do something different where I was creating something, you definitely feel different in the process, whether things get sold or not, um, it's either going to be one.

It's not good enough. Or two, it is good enough and people just don't think you can make money. And I've got to be fine with either of those [00:53:00] things because I can only want to control one of those things and controlling the one that the first one, uh, makes the process worthwhile. It's just trying to get better at the craft.

Um, and whether something gets sold or not, you know, that's, that's out of my control and that's why you're a. 

Brad Minus: Yes. Yeah. 

Eric Gee: I can probably read your personality as well if you want. Yeah. Hey, I know whatever you 

Brad Minus: think. Uh, and I can tell you a couple of, I can tell you a couple of things to, uh, to, to make it easier.

Um, when I was in high school, I was on the wrestling team. I would leave wrestling, um, and put on dance tights and go do tap jazz and ballet. Yeah. I was a musical theater. I was in the band. Uh, I was also on the cross country team. Um, I, yeah, uh, that was kind of like when I was, when I was younger than I was, I spent nine and a half years in the army.

Um, and, uh, I was in, I, I was in OEF, I, uh, um, I was in OEF and, [00:54:00] uh, IEF, uh, Operation Enduring Freedom, uh, Iraqi Enduring Freedom, um, OIF, Operation Iraqi Freedom, um, and, uh, Yeah, left that. And like I said, during the day, my, my day job is I'm an it program manager. And I, you know, I do the budgets. I liaise between the stakeholders and the, the developers, um, and developing team, the infrastructure team.

Um, and then of course I coach, uh, endurance sports to mostly to adults over the age of 40. I also have a cross country team, a high school cross country team that I coach, and then I do this, and this is a more of a passion project. Um, would I like to make money at it? Sure. But right now, I just love getting people information to help change their lives for the better, and moving them into the space they want to be in, um, where they feel good about themselves and where they're going with their life.

Eric Gee: I mean, that [00:55:00] in and of itself right there. I mean, obviously, I mean, I think just anyone listening to the descriptions of the packs, that's very clearly shaman, right? I mean, that's a shaman's life right there. So really in my mind, that's my process. Like which one of the shamans are you? And I have it between two, but I don't know which one.

Um, but I would like, so would you say that you're more of a communal person? Like it's all about building community for you, or would you say it's all about voicing like your, I don't say belief system, but voicing your ideas and voicing what you're really passionate about 

Brad Minus: that? You know what? That's a super interesting question because yes, when I have my tribe around me is when I feel the most comfortable, but I, I am at odds with myself.

about putting my ideas out there. So let me put it this way. I'm very, very, um, fact based and, uh, politically fact [00:56:00] based. So if you want to come at me as far as this, this election goes, you're going to have a, you're going to have your hands full. And I would like to put that out there, but I'm, I'm a little bit reserved at that point, as far as what that might do to my comp, Mike.

My community. So, yeah. No, I just answered my question. It's communal. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 

Eric Gee: Okay. That's, that's cool. So I think, and I've been actually, this is a very, I want to say it's, it is a common thing for a podcast about like self awareness and self knowledge for the host, because obviously that's clearly a priority for you is like sharing with people and helping them like reach their full potential.

But I would say a dolphin. And I've actually said that I've guessed that quite a bit for, I guess I've been correct. So hopefully I'm correct in this regard. If you read the profile on my website, you can probably go by that or the book, the book is obviously better because it's like way more in depth.

But I would say a dolphin and dolphins prioritize community within the shaman type, they might be the type who in high school might start a recycling club or, you know, something like they really believe in, but [00:57:00] like, create something out of it, obviously you're doing that already with like your coaching cross country and also like having clients.

And that's what you're working with them on. Um, but like you said, it's all about community and for dolphins. They're all about that too. Like they're community organizers basically. All right. Where, you know, they're, yeah. So that, that would be my guess as 

Brad Minus: adults. I just wish that, as far as a triathlete goes, that I could swim like one, but, um, but yes, , that's my only issue with triathlete than that.

I, I, I'll agree with you. But anyway. Hey, listen, Eric, this has been amazing and I've had such a great time just listening to you and, and conversing back and forth. Um, I think it's gonna be a, uh, a wonder for the. For the audience. I think they're going to get something great out of it. Oh, thanks for having me.

It was a great conversation. I had a lot of fun. I appreciate that. So listen, Eric G has his website project utopia. com. He is the author of the power of personality, unlock the secrets to understanding everyone in your life, [00:58:00] including yourself, and that's bolded and big, giant capitals. Um, so, uh, check that out.

You can get that on Amazon. I'm also going to link all of this and. His social, uh, social network profiles, um, in the show notes, if you're watching on YouTube, please like share, subscribe, um, hit that bell. So, you know, when the next episode is going to come in, drop a comment, tell us what it's like. If you're listening to us on a podcast network, please go ahead and, uh, you know, give us review, tell us, tell us what you thought.

And if it's a bad review, go ahead and give us a bad review, at least give me some feedback so I can make this show better. Um, so with that being said, thank you for listening and I will see you in the next one.