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Triumphing Over Adversity: A Woman's Journey Through Abuse, Codependency, and Spiritual Awakening with Jo Ann Fawcett

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Life-Changing Challengers
Triumphing Over Adversity: A Woman's Journey Through Abuse, Codependency, and Spiritual Awakening with Jo Ann Fawcett
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Season 1 Persistence Society & Culture Relationships

Imagine facing a childhood overshadowed by an alcoholic father, enduring the emotional rollercoaster of seven marriages, and confronting the specter of domestic violence. Joanne Fawcett, an author and speaker with a tale that is both harrowing and inspiring, joins us to share her extraordinary life story. Her candid revelations chart a course through the challenges of financial independence for women, the perils of codependency, and the quest for understanding in relationships, all within the framework of her experiences in the Mormon Church and beyond.

Throughout our conversation, Joanne peels back the layers of traditional marriage norms, recounting her personal confrontations with gender roles and the often-troubled waters of motherhood. She details her navigation through the complexities of church teachings and societal pressures, providing a rare glimpse into the nuances of finding true happiness and forging an identity free from the confines of expectation. Her reflections offer a roadmap for personal growth, acceptance, and the courage to step away from destructive partnerships, all while managing the realities of single parenthood and the scars left by past abuses.

Venturing into the spiritual, Joanne opens up about her psychic encounters and interactions with the spirit world. From sensing presences at funerals to establishing connections with spirits aboard the USS Hornet, her experiences invite us to reconsider conventional notions of the afterlife. Whether discussing the support from spirit guides or the evolution of her spiritual beliefs, Joanne's journey serves as an exploration of resilience, vulnerability, and the extraordinary influence that unseen forces can have on our lives. Join us as we navigate through these compelling stories and the lessons they hold.

Takeaways:

  • To get through trauma, do not be afraid to lean on your support system
  • It is not selfish to take care of yourself
  • Disregard the stigma of therapy.  
  • Do not be afraid to fire your therapist if you do not align
  • In an abusive relationship, you have to call the authorities
  • Do not rush into a relationship. Communicate.

Jo Ann's Book & Contact Info
Midlife Magic - Jo Ann Richards (Fawcett)
Facebook
Linkedin
Email: joann@midlifemagic.biz

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Contact Brad @ Life Changing Challengers
Instagram: @bradaminus
Facebook: @bradaminus
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YouTube: @lifechangingchallengers
LifeChangingChallengers.com

Want to be a guest on Life-Changing Challengers? Send Brad Minus a message on PodMatch, here.

Chapters

00:00 - Overcoming Abuse and Marriages

05:57 - Challenges in Traditional Marriage Norms

18:55 - Domestic Violence

29:06 - Marriage, Motherhood, and Memories

34:22 - Exploring Polygamy and Relationship History

39:49 - Navigating Relationships and Divorce Decisions

52:04 - Encountering Spirits and Psychic Experiences

58:07 - Spiritual Beliefs and the Spirit World

Transcript
WEBVTT

00:00:00.261 --> 00:00:02.466
All right, welcome everybody.

00:00:02.466 --> 00:00:05.655
And today I have with me Joanne Fawcett.

00:00:05.655 --> 00:00:15.442
She's an author, she's on speaker of topics such as UFOs, extraterrestrials, the paranormal and the military involvement that goes along with that.

00:00:15.442 --> 00:00:23.746
She also tells me that she's a crone, and we'll find out what that is a little bit later together, because I don't know either.

00:00:23.746 --> 00:00:28.841
As you can hear from her intro, she's a very accomplished woman.

00:00:28.841 --> 00:00:42.512
However, today we're going to go and have a discussion on her early life, where she had a life of abuse and she actually went through seven failed marriages, but she overcame all of that, and that's what I really want to get into.

00:00:42.512 --> 00:00:44.640
So how are you tonight, joanne?

00:00:45.082 --> 00:00:45.543
I'm great.

00:00:45.543 --> 00:00:46.085
How are you?

00:00:46.627 --> 00:00:47.951
I'm excellent, thank you.

00:00:47.951 --> 00:00:53.729
So all of the info I've read online seems to be more about what's happening in your life right now.

00:00:54.393 --> 00:01:03.694
And I apologize, I wasn't able to read your read your book Midlife Magic, but I really like to focus on how you got to where you are now.

00:01:03.694 --> 00:01:17.585
It seems like you went through a bunch of different journeys to get you to where you are and you're a wonderful person and I just would, I really like to find out, how does someone get through all that and come out the other side?

00:01:17.585 --> 00:01:21.765
Because I think the audience will take some numerous lessons away from it and it'll help.

00:01:21.765 --> 00:01:24.638
It'll help a lot of people and that's really what we're all about here.

00:01:24.819 --> 00:01:31.233
Okay, that is that is, and hopefully nobody else has to go through that many marriages to be happy.

00:01:32.620 --> 00:01:33.623
I'm hopefully not.

00:01:33.623 --> 00:01:36.611
You know, I think you probably gave Elizabeth Taylor a run for her money.

00:01:37.400 --> 00:01:39.725
You've actually been married to the same number of men.

00:01:39.725 --> 00:01:44.168
She just has one more marriage than I do Because she married Richard Burton twice.

00:01:44.168 --> 00:01:49.965
But I have a friend here who calls me Zha Zha, but I can't remember how many times Zha Zha Gabor was married, but a lot.

00:01:50.628 --> 00:01:52.210
Yes, yes, yes, she was.

00:01:52.210 --> 00:01:55.686
So let's, let's go back to the almost the very beginning.

00:01:55.686 --> 00:01:56.147
So can you?

00:01:56.147 --> 00:01:59.462
Tell me like where did you grow up and what was your childhood like?

00:02:00.325 --> 00:02:04.902
Sure, I grew up in Southern California, in the suburbs of Los Angeles.

00:02:04.902 --> 00:02:10.139
I am the third of fourth children, so I have that middle child probably syndrome going on.

00:02:10.139 --> 00:02:14.675
You know I have an older sister and older brother and a younger sister.

00:02:14.675 --> 00:02:17.264
For the most part my mom was a stay at home mom.

00:02:17.264 --> 00:02:18.868
My dad was working.

00:02:18.868 --> 00:02:21.758
He was a finance officer in the Army.

00:02:21.758 --> 00:02:29.659
He was in the Army when I was born and then, you know, he was in managerial positions using his numbers stuff.

00:02:29.659 --> 00:02:32.031
And you know, I come from a numbers background.

00:02:32.031 --> 00:02:36.044
Grandpa's and my sister, you know we're all accounting bookkeeping people.

00:02:36.044 --> 00:02:38.669
So it's interesting.

00:02:38.709 --> 00:02:52.753
I think I had the typical childhood it's like, except that you know my dad well, not, you don't know, my dad was an alcoholic, so that impacted things and there was, you know, there was a lot of arguing and it was interesting.

00:02:52.753 --> 00:03:04.683
You know, one of the reasons I became a bookkeeper was because I would watch my parents argue every month when it was time to pay the bills and then, after my dad died, I said mom, you know, why don't you know how to pay your own bills?

00:03:04.683 --> 00:03:07.270
I was only allowed to put the check in the envelope.

00:03:07.270 --> 00:03:11.972
So you know, part of my journey is like to empower women to.

00:03:11.972 --> 00:03:16.546
You know, do things that maybe you need to learn how to do for yourself.

00:03:16.546 --> 00:03:21.325
Even if you're still married, you know, you still need to have an active role in the finances of the family.

00:03:21.325 --> 00:03:26.641
I'm very firm on that belief, but it's like, unfortunately.

00:03:26.662 --> 00:03:37.245
I learned from my mom how to be codependent, you know, and how to enable the addict or alcoholic in your family and kind of just try to keep the peace.

00:03:37.245 --> 00:03:42.610
But on the other side, you know, we had a lot of fun camping vacations and our whole family.

00:03:42.610 --> 00:03:45.123
We were Girl Scouts, boy Scouts, you know all that stuff.

00:03:45.123 --> 00:03:47.229
So we had a lot of wholesome activities going on.

00:03:47.229 --> 00:03:59.081
And then, when I was about 10, I joined the Mormon Church because my best friend's family were Mormons and they started taking me to church, and so I was a Mormon for 30 years until that just didn't work for me anymore.

00:03:59.081 --> 00:04:05.913
And, let's see, I started to bring a young university right out of high school.

00:04:05.913 --> 00:04:09.627
I was there for two years and then got married for the first time.

00:04:09.627 --> 00:04:16.550
Five of my husbands were Mormons and yeah, no, that was part of the problem.

00:04:17.392 --> 00:04:17.913
Interesting.

00:04:18.536 --> 00:04:26.894
Because and I'll just say it's like because you're in the same church with somebody does not mean you're going to have a happy marriage.

00:04:26.894 --> 00:04:43.937
And it's like if you still get a little preachy on this now, it's like if you don't take the time to really get to know the person and if you don't take the time to talk about important and hard, difficult, important, intense things before you get married, it doesn't matter.

00:04:43.937 --> 00:04:52.596
Well, it might have helped, but just because you go to church together and you look good at church doesn't mean you're going to be the happy little spiritual family when you're not at church.

00:04:52.615 --> 00:05:05.918
So that sounds like that's some great advice, and I think that's one of the things that are going on today with our really horrific divorce rate is, I think, a lot of our marriages.

00:05:05.918 --> 00:05:22.288
They just don't take that time right to get to know each other so just step back a little bit, because I think there's this stigma around the Mormon church or, I guess, what is called the church of the Jesus Christ and Latter-day Saints, or LDS, yes.

00:05:22.769 --> 00:05:31.946
So can you provide a little bit of authentic background so maybe we can quell some of the some of the stereotypes and stigma that goes around with the Church of Latter-day Saints.

00:05:32.326 --> 00:05:33.934
They believe in happy families.

00:05:33.934 --> 00:05:39.490
They believe that you know husband and wife should be help meets, so to me that means equal partner.

00:05:39.490 --> 00:05:42.084
That just never translated into my marriages.

00:05:42.084 --> 00:05:49.432
They believe you know that you pray together, you go to church together, you do service and all this good stuff.

00:05:49.432 --> 00:06:01.067
They also believe that the man is the head of the household Some and take that to mean that you know you do whatever I say and I'm in charge and you know you're just the woman and you know.

00:06:01.767 --> 00:06:03.591
So literally living back in the 50s.

00:06:04.040 --> 00:06:04.601
Pretty much.

00:06:04.601 --> 00:06:17.663
And again it's like, even though I did grow up in the 50s and I always wanted the happy family with the white picket fence, I never got it and I was working pretty much during any of my marriages.

00:06:17.663 --> 00:06:28.665
The only time I didn't have to work is after my daughter was born and I stayed home with her until she started going to school and her dad had died, so I had some financial aid from that.

00:06:28.665 --> 00:06:34.622
I worked as much as the other the husbands did and brought in sometimes more money than they did.

00:06:34.622 --> 00:06:37.026
So basically.

00:06:37.528 --> 00:06:40.954
So it is basically, it sounds like a patriarchy.

00:06:42.000 --> 00:06:43.723
It's definitely a patriarchal church.

00:06:43.785 --> 00:06:51.591
Yes, but not so much that even back then they didn't disallow or didn't look down on you because you decided to work.

00:06:52.134 --> 00:06:53.298
No, no, no, no.

00:06:53.298 --> 00:06:56.990
And there were many women in the church who did work especially.

00:06:56.990 --> 00:07:01.745
You know I was a single mom off and on many times so it just kind of was normal.

00:07:01.745 --> 00:07:03.228
Most of the single moms worked.

00:07:03.228 --> 00:07:05.461
You know I never got well.

00:07:05.461 --> 00:07:11.528
I got a little bit of child support but I never got like alimony or any spousal support any time I got a divorce.

00:07:11.528 --> 00:07:14.937
So you know I worked or I starved.

00:07:14.937 --> 00:07:16.021
So I worked yeah.

00:07:16.401 --> 00:07:18.987
Okay, let's see, there's a statement.

00:07:19.267 --> 00:07:20.992
There's the statement I'm talking about.

00:07:21.440 --> 00:07:21.843
Is that.

00:07:21.843 --> 00:07:24.012
You know a lot of people feel that.

00:07:24.012 --> 00:07:25.360
You know, in the Mormon church it's.

00:07:25.360 --> 00:07:43.831
You know the woman is in the in the home and she's the slave to the dead and the and he respects dinner to be on the table when he walks in the door and the kids have to, you know they're be seen and not heard and all this and you've already one little thing, you've already quelled, and that's exactly what I was looking for.

00:07:43.932 --> 00:07:46.142
Yeah, I mean, and I did want the whole little.

00:07:46.142 --> 00:07:52.223
You know, stay at home, mom, have a bunch of babies, you know, have dinner on the table, and I did want that.

00:07:52.223 --> 00:07:58.925
That's just not the hand that the universe dealt me, so I've had to deal with it, so Okay.

00:07:59.185 --> 00:08:07.922
Well, no, and obviously you dealt with it right and sounds like the genes that you've got from your, from your parents, which was numbers worked in your favor.

00:08:08.302 --> 00:08:10.286
They did, that's fantastic.

00:08:10.608 --> 00:08:13.392
So you said that you met husband number one?

00:08:13.392 --> 00:08:15.083
Yes, in school.

00:08:15.925 --> 00:08:16.286
I did.

00:08:16.286 --> 00:08:27.487
I was going to BYU he was actually going to Utah State up in Logan but his friend's band was playing at our school dance and so he started asking me to dance and then we started dating.

00:08:27.487 --> 00:08:31.764
And yeah see, my mistake was I kept meeting all these people at the church dances.

00:08:32.287 --> 00:08:32.568
Oh, my God.

00:08:32.889 --> 00:08:35.259
Except for the two of that, were not members of the church.

00:08:35.259 --> 00:08:40.259
I met everybody else at a church dance, I think, or some obviously some church related activity.

00:08:40.259 --> 00:08:42.506
But yeah, we met, we got married.

00:08:42.506 --> 00:08:46.402
I think we met like right before Christmas break and I went home for school.

00:08:46.402 --> 00:09:01.861
But like by the following summer, you know, we were married but again, we didn't see each other all the time and the only reason really he got wanted to get married was because his I think I was like 20 when I got married and he was slightly older, but his family was really pushing him.

00:09:01.881 --> 00:09:04.639
You know you're old, you're, you know you're of the age you should get married.

00:09:04.639 --> 00:09:06.004
You should get married, find a wife.

00:09:06.004 --> 00:09:09.076
And I happened to be a home economics major at that time.

00:09:09.076 --> 00:09:12.206
Glad I didn't go into that field, but you know.

00:09:12.206 --> 00:09:14.009
So, yes, I was fair game.

00:09:14.009 --> 00:09:21.210
And then we get married and I mean before we, as we split up, oh, I never loved you.

00:09:21.210 --> 00:09:22.333
It's like what?

00:09:22.333 --> 00:09:25.563
No, I just married you because my family wanted me to get married.

00:09:25.563 --> 00:09:31.179
It's like, okay, this is not helpful and I was thin back then.

00:09:31.179 --> 00:09:45.830
I'm not super thin, I'm never super thin, but for a 20 year old I was thin and you know, but I wasn't model thin and he was a photographer, so he was used to looking at all these cute coeds and you know doing his photography stuff and you know you need to lose weight.

00:09:45.830 --> 00:09:50.225
It's like oh God, and you know it just so.

00:09:50.667 --> 00:09:55.245
The marriage lasted a year, if that, you know, I might have left before that.

00:09:55.245 --> 00:09:56.892
We even had our first year anniversary.

00:09:56.892 --> 00:09:59.721
So most of the marriages didn't last very long.

00:09:59.721 --> 00:10:02.969
But there's a, there's a repeating pattern.

00:10:02.969 --> 00:10:12.506
Number one I didn't know most of them very long before we got married because also in the Mormon church and this is not a myth it's like you're not supposed to have sex before you get married.

00:10:12.506 --> 00:10:16.004
So everybody's hormones are ranging and you're not.

00:10:16.004 --> 00:10:19.852
You know it's not supposed to live with them before you get married.

00:10:19.852 --> 00:10:22.827
So you know the logical thing is to get married.

00:10:22.827 --> 00:10:26.240
And what and what did he do after we got married?

00:10:26.240 --> 00:10:33.525
Years later I found out he did marry some cute, petite little thing and they started having babies in a who knows what.

00:10:33.525 --> 00:10:39.988
He didn't want any babies with me, but they started having babies and it's like, fine, you've got your petite little thing and that's great.

00:10:39.988 --> 00:10:42.464
I'm glad you're happy, you know, see you.

00:10:43.086 --> 00:10:44.129
Well, that's that.

00:10:44.129 --> 00:10:44.913
That's huge.

00:10:45.073 --> 00:10:45.856
I mean that's big of you.

00:10:45.897 --> 00:10:52.442
You know what I mean for you to sit there and say, well, listen, you know it didn't work out and I'm on what you wanted and I'm happy for you.

00:10:52.442 --> 00:10:56.332
I mean, how marriages has he gone through before you found this out?

00:10:56.332 --> 00:10:58.364
I?

00:10:58.403 --> 00:11:01.049
had been married the second time by the time.

00:11:01.049 --> 00:11:08.572
I found that out Because I married my daughter's father and I had her and he died when she was a baby.

00:11:08.572 --> 00:11:15.732
So you know, yeah, I found all that out when she was, you know, maybe a year old, so it wasn't that long.

00:11:16.159 --> 00:11:20.423
Oh, okay, so all right, so you can keep, just keep track.

00:11:20.423 --> 00:11:22.519
Yeah, this, we keep track.

00:11:22.519 --> 00:11:25.389
If you don't, you don't have to use the real names if you don't want to.

00:11:25.431 --> 00:11:27.782
But I don't care, the real names are in my book.

00:11:28.283 --> 00:11:31.952
Okay, so the first name of husband number one is Dean Wegstaff.

00:11:31.952 --> 00:11:34.961
Dean, and then husband number two.

00:11:35.363 --> 00:11:35.943
David.

00:11:36.625 --> 00:11:39.754
Okay, so, david, you had your daughter with us.

00:11:39.774 --> 00:11:57.730
I did, and yeah, it was interesting because he was not a member, he actually and I was hosting a Mormon singles you know activity at my house and as sister who was Mormon thought, well, if we just meet some nice Mormon girls, that'll help him, that'll help him.

00:11:57.730 --> 00:12:01.684
And so we met and hit it off and he wanted to get married right away.

00:12:01.684 --> 00:12:05.019
Because you know, and we did, you know we were married within a month.

00:12:05.019 --> 00:12:09.648
So I do not, I do not recommend that either.

00:12:09.648 --> 00:12:20.740
But fortunately for timing wise in the church, it's like I got pregnant right away, probably before we got married, and I didn't always follow the rules.

00:12:20.740 --> 00:12:22.625
I'm really good at not drinking.

00:12:22.625 --> 00:12:27.259
I didn't follow all the rules, but anyway.

00:12:27.259 --> 00:12:30.009
So it's the only time I've the only child I have.

00:12:30.009 --> 00:12:38.000
I think I got pregnant with somebody else you know another husband later, but that it didn't stick, but so she was the only child I have, so that was meant to be.

00:12:38.000 --> 00:12:41.727
And then asked how he died.

00:12:42.328 --> 00:12:45.214
Yeah he committed suicide when she was five weeks old.

00:12:45.214 --> 00:12:55.010
Yeah, he had some emotional problems and some mental health issues and addiction issues, so, but family didn't tell me any of that before we got married.

00:12:55.010 --> 00:12:58.625
They just thought if he marries a nice Mormon girl, it'll straighten them out.

00:12:58.625 --> 00:12:59.506
Well, it didn't.

00:12:59.506 --> 00:13:02.552
We were very happy until we weren't.

00:13:02.552 --> 00:13:09.765
You know, we would have had it for divorce because I, you know, being married to him kind of forced me to go inactive.

00:13:10.147 --> 00:13:18.397
You know, all of a sudden he didn't want me paying tithing, and then he'd make me feel guilty for going to church and I was stopping by the liquor store buying him alcohol.

00:13:18.397 --> 00:13:26.455
And it's like I'm a Mormon, I've never been in a liquor store, hardly ever, you know, maybe with my dad when I was a kid, but it's like, you know, this isn't something I do.

00:13:26.455 --> 00:13:30.706
So I came a really good codependent and enabler and it was hard.

00:13:30.706 --> 00:13:37.327
And you know he didn't say he joked about suicide, but he talked about it while we were together.

00:13:37.327 --> 00:13:48.892
And then, when I was seven months pregnant, you know, he was just starting to really spiral downhill and he kicked me out, which was a good thing, because then he was going to get suicidal again and I could have died.

00:13:48.892 --> 00:13:52.809
And then, while I was you know I had her.

00:13:52.809 --> 00:13:55.500
You know his parents told him that I had her.

00:13:55.500 --> 00:13:59.291
He saw her two times and then he committed suicide.

00:13:59.311 --> 00:14:01.057
Okay that one.

00:14:01.057 --> 00:14:02.080
That one had to be tough.

00:14:02.080 --> 00:14:03.903
That one had to be tough for you.

00:14:03.903 --> 00:14:10.043
How did you handle now you've got a newborn and now you're just lost your partner?

00:14:10.043 --> 00:14:12.250
How, how does someone handle that?

00:14:12.753 --> 00:14:15.503
Fortunately I was I when he kicked me out.

00:14:15.503 --> 00:14:16.847
I moved in with my parents.

00:14:16.847 --> 00:14:21.065
So you know my family was very close and then my sister lived across the street.

00:14:21.065 --> 00:14:27.669
My other sister lived in the area, but so you know my parents were there, my grandma, we all lived in one house.

00:14:27.669 --> 00:14:39.732
My sister and her family lived across the street and I had a lot of family support and I was going to church, so I had church support and so, I?

00:14:40.495 --> 00:14:43.241
I don't know, because he had already kicked me out, so it's like I wasn't.

00:14:43.241 --> 00:14:47.173
I knew we were heading for divorce if he hadn't Died.

00:14:47.234 --> 00:14:49.395
So but I imagine.

00:14:49.395 --> 00:14:52.070
I mean you had a, you had a daughter with this man.

00:14:52.070 --> 00:14:53.174
I'm sure that you were.

00:14:53.174 --> 00:14:54.943
You felt like you were still in love with him, correct?

00:14:55.326 --> 00:14:56.129
by the time he died.

00:14:56.129 --> 00:14:57.432
Maybe not so much.

00:14:57.932 --> 00:15:02.740
Okay, all right, it just had gotten the mental you feel it was.

00:15:02.740 --> 00:15:05.044
It was, it was just kind of was really starting to get to.

00:15:05.110 --> 00:15:23.903
Yeah it was difficult, and you know, to hear his psychologist or his psychiatrist say that he's suicidal, you know, and he didn't, he didn't, he didn't think he had problems or it's hard to explain, because he really didn't think he needed to be in therapy and to be working on these things.

00:15:23.903 --> 00:15:30.499
So he didn't see any problem with drinking and then driving his motorcycle, which he got into an accident.

00:15:30.499 --> 00:15:32.529
He, you know, he just yeah.

00:15:32.971 --> 00:15:34.755
Yeah, they didn't have any common sense.

00:15:34.755 --> 00:15:36.782
Once he's once, no once.

00:15:39.691 --> 00:15:55.169
And I and I remember you know the grandkids think I'm absolutely silly because it's like back then in the 70s, marijuana was illegal in California and I remember he had me drive with him to go buy some pot and I was terrified.

00:15:55.169 --> 00:16:05.730
I thought, and it's at night, it wasn't super late, but it's at night and I'm just, oh, we're gonna get caught, we're gonna get arrested and I'm pregnant and we're gonna get arrested and just like how it's just you know.

00:16:05.730 --> 00:16:15.581
And he is like he didn't care and he, you know, I would tell, I told my daughter it's like you know, your dad blues marijuana smoke in my face and I'm pregnant.

00:16:15.581 --> 00:16:17.208
I go, you know you don't do that to me.

00:16:17.208 --> 00:16:19.635
It's like I was never a pot smoker anyway.

00:16:19.635 --> 00:16:23.206
But it's like, don't blow smoke in my face and think it's funny.

00:16:23.947 --> 00:16:34.184
And you know, I got One time I told him it's like, you know, I hope there's nothing goes wrong with this baby because of all the drugs you've taken and that Kind of put him over the edge.

00:16:34.184 --> 00:16:38.557
You didn't like that, but it wasn't long after that that he kicked me out.

00:16:38.557 --> 00:16:42.284
So thankfully he kicked me out before he killed himself.

00:16:42.524 --> 00:16:46.830
So you know we're only on husband number two in my heart already starting to ache a little bit.

00:16:47.895 --> 00:16:48.927
He'll be crying with me.

00:16:48.927 --> 00:16:51.298
Yeah, but it sounds like.

00:16:51.359 --> 00:16:53.005
It sounds like you've already mentioned.

00:16:53.005 --> 00:16:54.049
A good thing that we're gonna get arrested.

00:16:54.049 --> 00:16:54.269
I mentioned.

00:16:54.269 --> 00:16:58.219
A good thing that will have a takeaway in the end is that you know getting over something like this.

00:16:58.219 --> 00:16:59.962
It sounds like a good support system.

00:17:00.691 --> 00:17:01.433
Yes, it is.

00:17:03.251 --> 00:17:07.239
A very big thing to have when you're going through stuff like this.

00:17:07.579 --> 00:17:11.915
Yeah, and the one thing you know I've learned later in life Therapy is really good.

00:17:11.915 --> 00:17:14.609
So don't think there's a stigma about having a therapist.

00:17:14.609 --> 00:17:18.683
I didn't have one back then, got one later on and I still have one now.

00:17:18.683 --> 00:17:20.549
But you know, therapy is really good.

00:17:21.111 --> 00:17:28.914
Yeah, I I've had my issues with therapy myself and that I understand is pretty much.

00:17:28.914 --> 00:17:34.574
It's really finding a connection between Exactly, and you've got to be.

00:17:34.574 --> 00:17:38.943
You can't be afraid to sit there and go hey, you know what great conversation.

00:17:38.943 --> 00:17:44.933
Don't feel it, I'm gonna find someone else, right, people that need to have that feeling there, where I know.

00:17:44.933 --> 00:17:49.569
I know from you, know from experience, that you kind of feel you get into the, you get into somebody.

00:17:49.569 --> 00:17:57.613
You've paid them a couple bucks for their time and then all of a sudden it's like, yeah, they won't really not really jiving, but you feel like, all right, well, I gotta give another try, I gotta give another try.

00:17:57.613 --> 00:17:57.792
Now.

00:17:57.792 --> 00:18:02.636
You, you know, and I've got several hundred or thousand dollars into it and you're like, well, I'm not gonna give up now.

00:18:06.330 --> 00:18:07.834
Sorry, there's a lot of you know.

00:18:07.834 --> 00:18:11.122
Put a lot of humor into this stuff, because what else am I gonna do?

00:18:12.472 --> 00:18:13.617
I think that's wonderful.

00:18:13.617 --> 00:18:17.173
I think that you've you've gotten to that mindset to where you could all right, you know what.

00:18:17.173 --> 00:18:17.916
This has happened to me.

00:18:17.916 --> 00:18:18.622
It's in the past.

00:18:18.622 --> 00:18:19.930
We're just gonna move on from there.

00:18:20.230 --> 00:18:23.861
Yeah, there's a comedy routine that keeps circling in my head, but I haven't gone there yet.

00:18:24.270 --> 00:18:28.761
Yeah, okay, well, just we're gonna have to come up with that because I don't be a nice little comic relief.

00:18:28.761 --> 00:18:31.497
Let's move on to husband number three.

00:18:31.718 --> 00:18:42.218
Okay, his name was Benny Joe, but we just called him Ben, and I think he was originally from the south, I think he was born in Missouri Um, sorry, this was the hardest one.

00:18:42.218 --> 00:18:49.979
He was a big guy and he was, you know, active in the Mormon Church and we met when my daughter was a toddler.

00:18:49.979 --> 00:19:06.678
She was like one, she was one some, you know, more than one, you know, but you're not quite two and I remember I started to date People and then, all of a sudden, nobody was asking me out and then this guy I was thinking of moving to Utah, to, you know, because why not?

00:19:06.678 --> 00:19:09.750
I'm a Mormon, I'll meet a good man there and I'll go back to school.

00:19:09.750 --> 00:19:11.958
That was my goal, I'll go back to school.

00:19:11.958 --> 00:19:40.556
And Then we started dating and Nobody else was asking me out and then we just kept dating and you know the hormones are raging and he's this really nice guy and he's, you know he's strict with my daughter, but he's also acting like he's this really loving dad and you know he just believes in being really strict and it's like here yeah, I wasn't quite sure how I liked that, because you know it's my toddler and you know, leave her the heck alone.

00:19:41.990 --> 00:19:50.470
But we got married and we eloped to Las Vegas and we should not have, because number one, I well Loping's not so bad.

00:19:50.470 --> 00:19:54.170
But on the way to dropping my daughter off at my mom's, we had a car accident.

00:19:54.170 --> 00:19:58.049
Somebody's lumber flew out of the back of their car and into the windshield.

00:19:58.049 --> 00:20:02.508
You know, my daughter got a cut on the head, so we went to the hospital first and then we went to Las Vegas.

00:20:02.508 --> 00:20:09.463
You know, here, mom, here's my, you know, stitched up kid and and my daughter's forgiven me many times over for all this shit, excuse my.

00:20:09.463 --> 00:20:26.349
So you know, we got, we got married, we eloped, we got married and then we moved into my apartment and he was we California for a few more years before we moved to Ohio where some of his family was.

00:20:27.070 --> 00:20:43.760
But he, he was very strict and he was very possessive and I wasn't working because I had these, you know, benefits from her dad having died is like every time I got married my benefits would stop, but she's got hers, so that helped us live because he never made very much money.

00:20:43.760 --> 00:20:56.883
But I remember it's like, and my parents just lived across town or a couple towns over, and it's like if I, if I, the house during the day and he didn't know where I was, he'd start calling around to look for me.

00:20:56.883 --> 00:21:09.430
I might have been out doing church work, I might have been at the grocery store, I might have just been across town visiting my mom because I didn't have to work and you know I could drive my little car over there and visit my parents and come home and be home.

00:21:09.430 --> 00:21:12.439
I was always home when he came home for dinner, you know that.

00:21:12.439 --> 00:21:15.749
But he, he would go around, it's like dude, knock it off.

00:21:15.749 --> 00:21:19.396
And and thought not, you know it was he.

00:21:19.396 --> 00:21:21.281
She had to stop drinking a bottle.

00:21:21.281 --> 00:21:35.430
He decided when she needed to go from a crib to a bed and I just didn't know how to say no, and that was my first big mistake and he thought nothing of spanking her through, and back then we were using cloth diapers.

00:21:35.430 --> 00:21:40.241
So you know, lots of layers and very yeah, but she's, you know, heavily padded.

00:21:40.241 --> 00:21:43.769
You know she can't feel that I go, she, you know you're, you're hitting child.

00:21:43.769 --> 00:22:01.923
She can tell that this is not a good thing and but he thought he needed to be super strict and it's like you know, this was a cause of friction right from the very beginning and Before we moved to Ohio we had bought a mobile home in a not great neighborhood in Southern California.

00:22:01.962 --> 00:22:11.369
But I Remember he came home from work because by then I think he was he anyway he worked, you know, like long shifts for the mortuary and stuff.

00:22:11.369 --> 00:22:20.890
So he put in a lot of hours and he'd come home and then I must have said something that pissed him off and he proceeded to break all the windows in our mobile home.

00:22:20.890 --> 00:22:30.170
It's like, excuse me, and and so took the kid and went down to the neighbors and then, you know, we finally kind of smoothed over.

00:22:30.170 --> 00:22:36.798
But I remember going to the church and saying, hey, you know, my husband just broke all the windows and well, has, did he hit you?

00:22:36.798 --> 00:22:38.241
I go, no, do you think he will I go?

00:22:38.241 --> 00:22:38.942
I have no idea.

00:22:39.371 --> 00:22:42.798
But I still decided to go ahead and move with him to Ohio.

00:22:42.798 --> 00:22:52.471
He had moved ahead of me to get things started and you know I should have just stayed behind and he'd gotten mad at my parents first for something, planning a birthday family the day.

00:22:52.471 --> 00:22:56.076
He couldn't come, because he was sure that they did that deliberately.

00:22:56.076 --> 00:22:59.509
And then he banned me from talking to my parents or seeing them.

00:22:59.509 --> 00:23:01.455
It's like, okay, this just doesn't happen.

00:23:01.455 --> 00:23:03.542
In my family we don't do that.

00:23:04.265 --> 00:23:09.509
And so as soon as he moved to Ohio I was seeing my family and of course that was a big fight when I got to Ohio.

00:23:09.509 --> 00:23:23.481
But not long after I got there he started hitting us and he hit her more than he hit me and again, she's a toddler and I was flabbergasted when he hit me for the first time.

00:23:23.481 --> 00:23:25.586
It's like what just happened?

00:23:25.586 --> 00:23:28.676
And you don't expect it.

00:23:28.676 --> 00:23:39.238
And I'm saying, and this is he's like no, he never beat me to a pulp, no, I never really had to go to the hospital, but I didn't go to the doctor at least once.

00:23:39.238 --> 00:23:45.460
But no, and I never called the cops and I never told the church leaders that we were being hit.

00:23:46.230 --> 00:23:59.178
And I remember I'd gone out this, this is the worst story but I'd gone out to do some church service with one of the ladies and I left her home with him because he was by then he was probably like an ambulance driver.

00:23:59.178 --> 00:24:01.959
He was an ENT or who knows what job he had at the time.

00:24:01.959 --> 00:24:02.712
He kept changing.

00:24:02.712 --> 00:24:12.018
But I came home and my little toddler is laying on the couch in her little pink, satiny quilted robe with the giant bruise on her face.

00:24:12.018 --> 00:24:16.537
I know, and I should have called the cops.

00:24:16.537 --> 00:24:17.339
I did not.

00:24:17.871 --> 00:24:19.435
And what's a two year?

00:24:19.435 --> 00:24:21.693
She's like two and it's like she couldn't.

00:24:21.693 --> 00:24:26.840
Yeah, she's very precocious and she's very precocious as she was.

00:24:26.840 --> 00:24:31.740
It's like, but what could a two year old do to piss somebody off so much that he's gotta hit?

00:24:31.740 --> 00:24:40.077
I mean, this guy was huge, he was one big, and it's like, oh my gosh, and I'd write around the same time.

00:24:40.077 --> 00:24:50.799
You know, then he hit me and I almost broke his thumb when he went to try and hit me again and I was like, yeah, this doesn't happen anymore and I don't that he hit us as much after that.

00:24:51.410 --> 00:25:01.557
But the marriage continued way longer than it should have and once I mean finally, I think we were together like three years and finally, you know, I'd had enough.

00:25:01.557 --> 00:25:12.398
He was off on his two day shift with the ambulance company and we'd had blizzards and while he was gone I had one of the church ladies have me pack up enough so I could like ship it off.

00:25:12.398 --> 00:25:25.693
I'd called my mom, said I gotta leave, and she and my grandma pulled the money together, got me an airplane ticket and he came home from work and I said we're leaving, you're driving us to the airport tomorrow and that's it, end of discussion.

00:25:25.693 --> 00:25:36.040
And thankfully the blizzards had stopped enough so that we could drive from where we lived over to Cleveland, and then I moved in with the family until the next guy.

00:25:36.040 --> 00:25:40.301
But yeah, I mean, that was that's another lesson.

00:25:40.410 --> 00:25:45.297
It's like if there's violence, call the cops, cause your church leaders aren't gonna do anything anyway.

00:25:45.297 --> 00:25:46.160
It's like what can they do?

00:25:46.160 --> 00:25:48.593
But you have to call the cops If you're in danger.

00:25:48.593 --> 00:25:54.138
I don't care how much he apologizes, I don't care how, it doesn't matter.

00:25:54.138 --> 00:25:56.718
You have to call the cops and get them taken care of.

00:25:56.718 --> 00:26:02.238
Well, get them arrested, right, sorry, I don't wanna say what's going through my mind.

00:26:02.349 --> 00:26:03.454
No, no, it's fine.

00:26:03.454 --> 00:26:08.500
So that's basically that's a great friggin' rule.

00:26:08.500 --> 00:26:16.609
But at that time in our, I'm thinking this maybe what 1979, 1980?

00:26:16.690 --> 00:26:17.673
Yeah, yeah, right in there.

00:26:18.309 --> 00:26:21.548
You said blizzard, that's what, that's what we're doing yeah, yeah, yeah, 1979.

00:26:21.548 --> 00:26:38.880
So at that time and I was a little young at that point, so at that time were you in that time in our history it was not readily available.

00:26:38.880 --> 00:26:46.377
I mean, women couldn't just go to the cops and say my husband did this to me and have them be believed.

00:26:47.170 --> 00:26:47.932
Yeah, I can't.

00:26:47.932 --> 00:26:48.776
I can imagine.

00:26:48.776 --> 00:26:53.717
Well, I know anybody who'd had that problem, and it certainly wasn't talked about at church.

00:26:53.717 --> 00:26:59.896
Right, you know you never heard of anybody having domestic violence in their homes.

00:27:00.458 --> 00:27:00.679
Yeah.

00:27:00.679 --> 00:27:09.236
So whereas today it's pretty prevalent and there are programs beyond programs about how to get out of a relation, of an abusive relationship like that.

00:27:09.236 --> 00:27:15.036
Yeah, and you were stuck in it and, wow, that's, that's butchered out of it.

00:27:15.390 --> 00:27:19.896
Yeah, and that goes beyond the man being the house head of the house and you do what the man says.

00:27:19.896 --> 00:27:21.213
It's just yeah, no.

00:27:22.156 --> 00:27:29.298
I agree, no, and even if I can go back in time and think about that, it's still like that's just over the top.

00:27:29.298 --> 00:27:34.357
Yeah, but you had, you were enough to sit there and finally, at the last straw, and say, nope, I'm out.

00:27:34.357 --> 00:27:42.701
And again support system that was able to help you and get you out of that and bring you back home to where you felt safe.

00:27:43.270 --> 00:27:49.273
Yeah, that was good because her, her, you know we always stayed close with them throughout her whole.

00:27:49.273 --> 00:28:11.317
They're past now but you know they always thought of me as their daughter-in-law and I'm at a how many people I married and they always treated her, you know, they just loved her to pieces and we were always a close part of their family and that was really nice because you know she's close with her aunts Well, she's got one living aunt now, but on that side of the family, so she's still close with that side of the family.

00:28:11.317 --> 00:28:17.777
But you know great memories with you know growing up and visiting her grandparents and stuff, and so that that's really good.

00:28:17.777 --> 00:28:19.778
It's like I wasn't going to cut her off.

00:28:19.778 --> 00:28:21.355
There was no need to cut her off from them.

00:28:21.355 --> 00:28:22.051
You know that was.

00:28:22.051 --> 00:28:24.992
You know it's not her fault that her dad died.

00:28:25.510 --> 00:28:29.276
So, so, before we go any further, can we, can we put a name to your daughter?

00:28:29.276 --> 00:28:30.759
Just the first one oh, Melissa.

00:28:30.759 --> 00:28:31.510
Melissa.

00:28:31.510 --> 00:28:33.471
Okay, great, just so I can.

00:28:33.471 --> 00:28:40.395
We can call her Melissa, we don't have to keep calling her the daughter, and hopefully that she was young enough that she doesn't remember that.

00:28:41.049 --> 00:28:42.154
She remembers everything.

00:28:42.154 --> 00:28:43.311
She remembers.

00:28:43.311 --> 00:28:45.057
She remembers all the heading.

00:28:45.057 --> 00:28:50.395
She remembers one time, I think when she was four, she went to bed during her nap.

00:28:50.395 --> 00:28:54.673
He made her go outside to the tree and get a switch so he could spank her.

00:28:54.673 --> 00:29:01.596
Yeah, she remembers all that and she's she's in her mid 40s, so she remembers it all.

00:29:01.596 --> 00:29:05.375
She's forgiven me and we're best friends now, but she remembers it all.

00:29:05.375 --> 00:29:07.333
Yeah, it's horrible.

00:29:08.029 --> 00:29:10.570
Just just the fact that she remembers it, that's just yeah.

00:29:10.570 --> 00:29:13.897
I was hoping that you were going to say no, she was too by what it's gone.

00:29:14.450 --> 00:29:15.493
No, she remembers everything.

00:29:15.493 --> 00:29:16.758
Oh geez yeah.

00:29:17.349 --> 00:29:17.972
That's crazy.

00:29:17.972 --> 00:29:23.813
So you moved back, moved back to parents and Melissa's with you, which is great, and she's out of danger.

00:29:23.813 --> 00:29:27.555
Yeah, and how did we meet husband number four?

00:29:28.037 --> 00:29:28.458
A church.

00:29:28.858 --> 00:29:29.138
A church?

00:29:29.138 --> 00:29:31.974
Okay, another church singles dance.

00:29:32.616 --> 00:29:35.536
Yeah, and he was.

00:29:35.536 --> 00:29:40.097
You know, again, these guys are so charming on the dance floor and they're charming at church.

00:29:40.097 --> 00:29:48.878
They've got this public face and the not so public face and and I mean, dated, but again, we're not talking about the important stuff.

00:29:48.878 --> 00:29:51.217
You know, it's like people.

00:29:51.217 --> 00:30:00.657
You need to sit down and talk about your finances and about your parenting and this and that and this and that, and you know, I just to sit, all these men would want to start having babies.

00:30:00.657 --> 00:30:06.559
Well, apparently he didn't want to have one with me either, and so it really bothered him that I was kind of pushing him.

00:30:06.559 --> 00:30:08.757
Well, let's try for a kid, yeah, and that was just one thing.

00:30:09.470 --> 00:30:22.959
And again, our marriage didn't last very long and he just turned out to be a jerk and he was again abusive, but he wasn't as affectionate as I would have liked and he just didn't seem interested in that much.

00:30:22.959 --> 00:30:41.576
And it's like I remember again that this certain male mindset is like, well, he, he was going to school or he was, you know, training, and so he wasn't well employed, but he got a job, like for a company that delivered ice cream and milk really good ice cream and milk, and you know around the area and stuff.

00:30:41.576 --> 00:30:44.813
And well, you know, I have a real job because I'm working.

00:30:44.813 --> 00:30:46.598
It's physical labor.

00:30:46.598 --> 00:30:49.415
You don't have a real job because you're just a bookkeeper.

00:30:49.415 --> 00:31:06.318
It's excuse me, I'm using my brain every day and I'm making more money than you, but I didn't add up but it's like I'm making at least or more money than you are and I work full time and thankfully I never had to pay for childcare because, you know, we lived on a family complex.

00:31:06.470 --> 00:31:11.333
My mom had bought this big property in Northern California so we all lived there, you know, so she could play.

00:31:11.333 --> 00:31:14.095
My daughter played with the grandmas and the console.

00:31:14.095 --> 00:31:15.997
She loved part of her growing up.

00:31:15.997 --> 00:31:20.401
But in one time she again very precocious child.

00:31:20.401 --> 00:31:25.963
So for some reason she kicked him and she was seven.

00:31:25.963 --> 00:31:27.516
Come on, how hard could that be?

00:31:27.516 --> 00:31:28.432
I mean, how hard.

00:31:28.432 --> 00:31:38.673
She didn't hurt him and he wore cowboy boots and he kicked her and she still has a dent in her leg to this day from that kick.

00:31:38.673 --> 00:31:41.016
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:31:41.016 --> 00:31:44.977
And then the other thing he didn't really hit me, but what did he do?

00:31:44.977 --> 00:31:49.439
Like I was trying to be affectionate, so I don't know what body part I grabbed.

00:31:49.439 --> 00:31:53.414
You know nothing, totally you know I might've just grabbed his butt or something, I don't know.

00:31:53.414 --> 00:32:06.055
But you know, and he totally just like really got Matt and like, yeah, anyway, he was like if it wasn't his idea, you know, forget it yeah so this was last number four.

00:32:06.095 --> 00:32:14.489
I mean, I'm a husband and it's the first name, just so we can oh, his first name, jack I.

00:32:14.489 --> 00:32:17.340
This really wasn't didn't last all that long.

00:32:17.340 --> 00:32:18.727
You still had a search for that.

00:32:18.727 --> 00:32:19.329
I saw that.

00:32:20.915 --> 00:32:23.105
Well, see, in the book we came up with.

00:32:23.105 --> 00:32:27.736
Their names are in the book, but we came up with some really fun sarcastic titles for each.

00:32:27.736 --> 00:32:31.564
Each husband and his chapter is called hit the road jacks.

00:32:31.584 --> 00:32:33.192
Oh, it's perfect.

00:32:33.192 --> 00:32:33.874
It's perfect.

00:32:33.874 --> 00:32:39.953
Hey, it just just so you know that that book is called Midlife magic right?

00:32:39.994 --> 00:32:43.682
Yes, and it's by my last married name, so it's by Joanne Richards.

00:32:43.682 --> 00:32:45.194
So and Richard.

00:32:47.011 --> 00:32:47.935
And it's on Amazon.

00:32:47.935 --> 00:32:56.713
But yeah and in the show notes I'm gonna have a link on the Amazon and then also to the publisher, because she see, your, is it a publisher?

00:32:56.713 --> 00:32:57.737
Is it actually self-published?

00:32:58.219 --> 00:33:05.478
I sell, publish it, but I, you know, have publishing company because you're supposed to come up with an imprint, so it's called dragon hill books net.

00:33:05.478 --> 00:33:09.049
But yeah, so you can get it that way or through all the online things.

00:33:09.351 --> 00:33:13.089
Yeah, yeah, great, and I'm gonna, I'm gonna head and I'm going to link to that back.

00:33:13.089 --> 00:33:15.965
But now let's get back, because we have to talk about husband number five.

00:33:16.367 --> 00:33:18.214
Oh yeah, this is the burgum young wannabe.

00:33:18.214 --> 00:33:20.080
Oh, husband number five.

00:33:20.080 --> 00:33:25.430
He was ember and he'd been married a couple times before and he had three kids.

00:33:25.430 --> 00:33:29.541
And I met him when my daughter, melissa was.

00:33:29.541 --> 00:33:32.755
She was more than eight, so she could have been.

00:33:32.755 --> 00:33:41.420
Not, she was eight or nine, I don't know if she was nine, but yeah, she could well anyway, eight or nine, let's pick you stick, stick in there.

00:33:41.420 --> 00:33:48.540
So she was like in fourth grade and he and I met at this like single adults camp out.

00:33:48.540 --> 00:33:50.607
You brought your kids if you wanted, so she and I.

00:33:50.607 --> 00:33:52.512
That's about the only time she and I ever camp together.

00:33:52.512 --> 00:33:55.662
I grew up camping and never took her camping, except that one time.

00:33:55.662 --> 00:33:57.055
She was not happy.

00:33:57.490 --> 00:34:12.460
But he and I met and we're having this conversation with other people and he mentioned something about Polygamy and I said, well, I'm not against the the, I'm not against the concept, but thinking like, see in the Mormon Church, even though it's not legal to do that now.

00:34:12.460 --> 00:34:21.905
But you know they tell you like after you die, if you're really good and you go to this one level of heaven, you know the husbands could have more than one wives over on the other side.

00:34:21.905 --> 00:34:24.054
There it's like okay, whatever it's like, I can live with that.

00:34:24.054 --> 00:34:31.440
You know, I Never what would come out of his mouth, but he wanted to practice polygamy in real life.

00:34:31.440 --> 00:34:37.697
I know he never succeeded, trust me, because he could hardly stay employed.

00:34:37.697 --> 00:34:42.592
His name is Richard, his name is Richard and he was.

00:34:42.592 --> 00:34:43.175
He didn't.

00:34:43.175 --> 00:34:54.019
He had a lot of financial issues and and I was working and I probably was only working part-time then, but I had a really successful Avon business and I was working doing bookkeeping part-time.

00:34:54.563 --> 00:34:56.110
What my mom had Avon.

00:34:56.110 --> 00:34:59.577
I was good and it was so that you say that.

00:34:59.577 --> 00:35:01.663
So I just this is a total danger.

00:35:02.692 --> 00:35:03.876
Stuff all over the house right.

00:35:04.199 --> 00:35:08.295
There was, there was, and it was completely and you know it's so interesting, is that?

00:35:08.295 --> 00:35:22.851
So I was in, I was in Mississippi playing golf one year and and I didn't know anything about this, but I'm like my god, the bugs out here are just absolutely crazy oh everybody tells me yes, they were like oh yeah, no, no, come on summer.

00:35:22.851 --> 00:35:27.981
We go by Avon skin so soft, bought a case, we slap that stuff on.

00:35:28.001 --> 00:35:37.835
They won't touch you for years, partner, yeah that was sad part of me not leaving Avon, because I ran out of skin so soft but the other, the was is um.

00:35:38.177 --> 00:35:55.434
So I my, my day is, I am a business process Um re-engineering, re-engineering manager at um spinal center and we just got a brand new doorbell and it's that doorbell that they had in the commercials Avon calling.

00:35:55.434 --> 00:35:58.295
So, yeah, it just kind of brought it up.

00:35:58.295 --> 00:35:59.891
I'm sorry but it's okay.

00:35:59.972 --> 00:36:03.362
It's okay, we have fond memories of mom's avon business and I did.

00:36:03.362 --> 00:36:05.650
I did it when I, you know, really worked it.

00:36:05.650 --> 00:36:05.971
So.

00:36:05.971 --> 00:36:13.635
But anyway, richard guy, he, he really wanted to practice polygamy so and so we actually never got married.

00:36:13.655 --> 00:36:28.635
It was a common law marriage and we told people we got marriage Married because on the one hand we're still going to the Mormon church, so you can't tell him you're living in sin, and then the other hand, we're exploring like new age religions and things like that, so we're dabbling and other things.

00:36:28.635 --> 00:36:48.434
And you know he was out trying to meet other women and every now and then he'd go on dates and once or twice he'd bring him to the house and I was just the roommate and yeah, it was crazy, he was never successful at that whole thing working out, because you know you have to have enough money to support people and it just you know.

00:36:48.434 --> 00:36:54.581
And then you've got some women, it's like and so and you don't, if you're going to try polygamy, don't try to date Mormon women because they're going to tell.

00:36:54.581 --> 00:36:57.079
So I think somebody told on him.

00:36:57.079 --> 00:37:04.983
But eventually, you know, I don't know he's been married almost as many times as I have, apparently, because I still I touch with a couple of his kids.

00:37:06.110 --> 00:37:09.739
So oh yeah, because he had three kids, so they they did with you.

00:37:09.739 --> 00:37:10.460
So he started.

00:37:10.460 --> 00:37:11.543
Don't have a bond with them.

00:37:12.269 --> 00:37:18.824
I did because we were together like five years until things were just going really bad and we decided, okay, now we're divorced.

00:37:18.824 --> 00:37:21.010
But so it's an easy divorce.

00:37:21.010 --> 00:37:28.557
But the other the, his kind of abuse, was because he wasn't good with finances, even though he thought he was he.

00:37:28.557 --> 00:37:38.009
He talked to me into investing some money I was managing for somebody who had said don't, don't invest it in this, and that's exactly what he wanted to invest it in.

00:37:38.009 --> 00:37:46.583
So I said okay and of course you know I'm trying to see support him and he lost it all and then I had to pay that person back.

00:37:46.583 --> 00:37:56.458
So it's like so now, now I'm we're, we broke up and now I'm in debt, up the yin yang, and now I'm not committing, now I'm not committing, now I'm filing for bankruptcy.

00:37:56.458 --> 00:38:00.659
And as soon as we split up, he met somebody else and started having kids.

00:38:00.659 --> 00:38:04.559
Now I, he and I got pregnant once and then I lost it.

00:38:04.559 --> 00:38:10.023
So it's like again, my, my melissa, the only child I've ever had, the only obviously I'm not having anymore.

00:38:10.023 --> 00:38:12.815
But he went right on to start having more.

00:38:12.815 --> 00:38:27.101
So he had at least three with her, yeah, and Named their boy what I was going to name our boy if we'd had one and and then I went to bankruptcy court Because he was the main, he was the reason I filed bankruptcy.

00:38:27.829 --> 00:38:32.219
Um, here they all traipse in him and all the babies, the wife and the babies.

00:38:32.219 --> 00:38:37.432
That's like Really, I'm humiliated Beyond belief.

00:38:37.432 --> 00:38:40.139
And you bring all the, the wife and all the babies.

00:38:40.139 --> 00:38:43.036
So that was yeah, so we've got.

00:38:43.036 --> 00:38:49.643
We've had no physical abuse, we've had financial abuse, you've got some emotional abuse going with the ones who just dig at you, so yeah.

00:38:49.643 --> 00:38:54.099
And then and the guy who died, but Um, so yeah, that was number five.

00:38:54.099 --> 00:38:58.340
So that was a long, that was a pretty long marriage compared to the others.

00:38:59.289 --> 00:39:02.239
So yeah, so how did you meet husband number six?

00:39:03.231 --> 00:39:03.873
A church dance.

00:39:03.873 --> 00:39:12.862
Well, I love to dance, you know, and it's one of the only activities that they have for the adult church singles.

00:39:12.862 --> 00:39:17.389
And I think I met him first at like a conference for the adult church singles.

00:39:17.389 --> 00:39:24.833
And then I met him at a dance and you know he was a good dancer and we hit it off and Then we got married.

00:39:24.972 --> 00:39:38.990
And I think the only reason why I really married him because my daughter was a junior in high school by then and she was going to go off and be a foreign exchange student and I didn't Internalize it at the moment, but it's like I didn't want to be alone Now.

00:39:38.990 --> 00:39:46.119
That would have been the best thing for me to just stay in my apartment, work and support her while she was in Japan.

00:39:46.119 --> 00:39:46.922
I didn't do that.

00:39:46.922 --> 00:39:50.947
I got married before she left for Japan, but I didn't move in with him till after she left.

00:39:50.947 --> 00:40:06.255
You know, we would trade off weekends at each other's houses and she went to Japan and then she came back and he and I were kind of rocky and I we separated for a while and then he, you know, wooed me back into thinking everything was fine and and I was, but I mean we were both working.

00:40:06.255 --> 00:40:07.619
So the money was okay.

00:40:07.619 --> 00:40:10.150
Um it just he was boring.

00:40:10.931 --> 00:40:25.594
Okay, it was, he was boring and it's like I really realized I only I'm married because of my daughter and he was like 13 years older than me and he had a stepson that I didn't get along with and and so two stories with him.

00:40:25.594 --> 00:40:29.429
It's like I was turning 40 when I married him and he said, well, where do you want to go for dinner?

00:40:29.429 --> 00:40:30.514
And I said this place.

00:40:30.514 --> 00:40:34.550
And so I get home from work and they go, okay, the dinner, and we go to that place.

00:40:34.550 --> 00:40:37.541
It's like, but I wanted to go here, it's my birthday.

00:40:37.541 --> 00:40:38.927
Well, we wanted to go here.

00:40:38.927 --> 00:40:39.469
He and his son.

00:40:39.469 --> 00:40:42.442
It's like well, this is uh yeah.

00:40:42.590 --> 00:40:43.192
This gruy.

00:40:43.192 --> 00:40:45.500
I mean, I liked the restaurant but it's not where I wanted to go.

00:40:45.500 --> 00:40:56.842
So I had three friends Girlfriends from where I used to live and they each took me out for three more birthday dinners at the places I like to go and that brings us back to number one a good support system.

00:40:56.842 --> 00:40:57.831
Exactly.

00:40:58.211 --> 00:40:59.454
Well you're while you're well.

00:40:59.494 --> 00:41:11.081
Hey, this is great, yeah, and you know I started therapy while I was married to him and Then finally I said you know we have pro, and will you come to therapy with it?

00:41:11.081 --> 00:41:13.715
No, it's all your fault, it's like, excuse me.

00:41:13.715 --> 00:41:16.416
So he refused to go to therapy with it.

00:41:16.416 --> 00:41:17.920
I'm okay, then I'm out of here.

00:41:17.920 --> 00:41:19.512
I'm out of here for good now.

00:41:19.512 --> 00:41:25.074
And you know I had a friend come help me pick up all my crap and we, you know, put it in storage.

00:41:25.074 --> 00:41:37.900
I moved in with her again another supportive friend and um, yeah then, but it took, and I don't think we ever we're we're gonna try to get back together, but we just kind of didn't hurry the divorce along.

00:41:37.900 --> 00:41:42.789
I think it took almost another year and a half before we really got busy and did the divorce.

00:41:42.789 --> 00:41:45.179
But again, I'm the one getting all the paperwork filled out.

00:41:45.219 --> 00:41:52.222
But um, yeah, so just yeah, I, I know the bookkeeper you're, you're the one that's got to die for details.

00:41:52.590 --> 00:41:55.280
Yeah, and it's not like you know we, we weren't gonna.

00:41:55.280 --> 00:41:58.398
There was alimony going to be paid because we were both working.

00:41:58.398 --> 00:42:01.969
You know we were both, you know, had our own kids to support.

00:42:01.969 --> 00:42:09.902
Or he had a house that you know I didn't ever want to live out again because it was in a crappy neighborhood and it's like you know I, there was no for me to claim this house.

00:42:09.902 --> 00:42:11.110
We hadn't even been married that long.

00:42:11.110 --> 00:42:13.315
So it's like you know we, there's a clean break.

00:42:13.315 --> 00:42:19.632
It just took a while before we got around to doing the paperwork and it's not like either one of us Was I dating?

00:42:19.632 --> 00:42:21.094
Did I start dating somebody?

00:42:21.094 --> 00:42:30.378
I, I dated somebody before the divorce was final, but I don't know, oh, I, I forget, I, I forget that there was this big gap.

00:42:30.378 --> 00:42:40.054
But anyway, we got a divorce and and that was fine, and you know that I did start dating again and yeah, yeah, and then we get to husband number seven.

00:42:40.896 --> 00:42:44.759
Who was mark and and mark is your mark is the military intelligence.

00:42:45.369 --> 00:42:49.141
Yes, and and we got there like 25 years, so oh, wow.

00:42:49.530 --> 00:42:56.615
Yeah, that's the one I just our divorce is almost I mean, was final almost a year ago and it was interesting because I was dating.

00:42:56.615 --> 00:42:57.777
This is funny.

00:42:57.777 --> 00:43:11.902
It's like I was dating the southern guy who wasn't a member but like I think he had his brother that was a member and his brother had talked him into going to church dance, so that's how we met Another dance, but, um, he was a really good dancer, so we were getting along, we were dating and stuff.

00:43:11.902 --> 00:43:32.998
But then I also met mark, and my roommate, whose husband is in prison, introduced me to him and it's like, oh, this guy's really smart, he's really charming, we're having a lot of fun talking and I think even before I actually met him in person, I told this free guy oh, I've met this other guy I like better and he was mad at me.

00:43:32.998 --> 00:43:43.750
So that was a big mistake, but it's the path I chose and so, yeah, number one being being married to somebody in prison, is a whole unique experience.

00:43:44.311 --> 00:43:47.302
So yeah, and we're definitely going to delve into that.

00:43:47.302 --> 00:43:51.355
Yeah, but you just had as a mistake but you were with mark for 25 years.

00:43:51.355 --> 00:43:52.981
Doesn't sound like it was too much of a mistake?

00:43:53.489 --> 00:43:59.036
Well, had I had a, if I'd had hindsight, I I would have stuck with the free guy.

00:43:59.617 --> 00:44:07.349
Okay, all right, let's, let's, let's do that a little bit, then, because I mean mark wasn't, I mean he didn't go to prison right away and you were together a long long time, right?

00:44:07.449 --> 00:44:08.735
He was in prison when we met.

00:44:09.369 --> 00:44:14.090
Oh yeah, a lot of that happened again, my, my that.

00:44:14.130 --> 00:44:17.634
Let me move out of husband's number six, his house.

00:44:17.634 --> 00:44:24.829
Her husband was in prison for something he did do and I, you know, I visited him a couple times.

00:44:24.829 --> 00:44:32.538
So I was, I was at the prison setting and then I was visiting this cute young guy who was in prison, who was fun, and you know we visited a lot.

00:44:32.538 --> 00:44:42.675
But, um, and then she came home one day said oh, I met this really nice guy, he's really smart, he's your age, he was visiting with his mom today and I said, oh, smart, that'd be kind of a different boyfriend for me.

00:44:42.675 --> 00:44:50.567
I'll, I'll meet him, you know, but it took a couple months for me to get approved to visit and so we wrote a lot, you know.

00:44:50.567 --> 00:44:53.047
So here's getting to know each other through letters.

00:44:53.199 --> 00:45:01.487
And you know, this guy's really smart, he grew up in a military family, he's lived in many places around the world and you had all these great stories.

00:45:01.487 --> 00:45:03.306
And then we got to meet in person.

00:45:03.306 --> 00:45:27.907
And then, yeah, and it was really interesting because I was at a Thanksgiving weekend with my family and usually I would stay the whole four days and it's like I'm sorry I have to cut the weekend short because I have a first date with this guy and he's in prison and they just about lost it because they knew I was dating this new guy who was smart and rich and all this stuff, and so everybody thought I had this great catch.

00:45:27.907 --> 00:45:36.608
You know that I'd lined up this great catch finally, because I just wasn't telling people that he was in prison, and so then it came out.

00:45:36.608 --> 00:45:42.764
So then they were very sad, but they got over it, even though they wanted me to leave him a lot sooner than I ever did.

00:45:44.181 --> 00:45:48.271
So what made someone get married to someone that's in prison?

00:45:48.820 --> 00:45:54.451
That's a good question, partly because we got along for the most part.

00:45:54.451 --> 00:45:59.346
You know, we had a lot of intellectual compatibility and he had a lot of great stories.

00:45:59.346 --> 00:46:09.369
So we were just talking all the time and I'd never been used to having long conversations with anybody I was married to and we're both in our forties or early by the time we met.

00:46:09.369 --> 00:46:16.248
So, it's like you know, and I was already heading to the menopause, it's like I didn't, there was not gonna be any more kids.

00:46:16.248 --> 00:46:21.447
You know, I thought maybe if we hurry up and get married and if he could have a family visit, maybe there'd be.

00:46:21.447 --> 00:46:25.864
Or, you know, if he'd been out, you know we wanted to try it for our kid, but okay, there were no kids.

00:46:25.864 --> 00:46:32.130
Really, you know, we didn't expect to have kids and I just didn't realize how I didn't.

00:46:33.019 --> 00:46:39.106
I had to think far enough advanced, like what is life really like if the guy's never gonna be home Cause he has a life without parole sentence?

00:46:39.106 --> 00:46:44.686
But at the time I met him he thought, oh, I have a lawyer working on this and I should be out in a couple of years.

00:46:44.686 --> 00:46:46.646
It's like, oh, I can do two years of this.

00:46:46.646 --> 00:46:53.181
This is, you know, I'll see you every weekend and I saw him several times a week, cause my office was really close to the prison where he was at.

00:46:53.181 --> 00:46:56.108
When I met him I thought, oh, two years, okay, I can, I can years.

00:46:56.108 --> 00:46:58.047
Well, two years turned into 25.

00:46:58.047 --> 00:47:09.007
And his lawyer at that time frotted him, wasn't really working on his you know appellate work, and so he lost thousands of dollars and nothing ever happened.

00:47:09.079 --> 00:47:14.184
So it's been a long, you know a long uphill battle trying to find new remedies.

00:47:14.184 --> 00:47:16.947
And now he's I'll be 70.

00:47:16.947 --> 00:47:18.246
So he's already 70.

00:47:18.246 --> 00:47:20.246
He's been in prison almost 40 years.

00:47:20.246 --> 00:47:22.664
I still believe.

00:47:22.664 --> 00:47:27.088
I mean I don't want to be married to the guy, but I still firmly believe he didn't do what they said he did.

00:47:27.088 --> 00:47:30.086
So I'm okay with saying that.

00:47:30.086 --> 00:47:33.045
But yeah, I mean he is very smart.

00:47:33.045 --> 00:47:40.590
Just turns out there's a lot of things he was not very honest about and, yeah, and it turns out he's a narcissist.

00:47:40.590 --> 00:47:42.346
So book number two is all about him.

00:47:43.039 --> 00:47:46.469
Oh my God, so I shouldn't laugh.

00:47:46.469 --> 00:47:51.367
Maybe you could just put it at a 30,000 foot level of what they accused him of doing.

00:47:51.619 --> 00:47:58.905
Sure, they accused him of masterminding a murder of somebody there in Northern California and the murder happened.

00:47:58.905 --> 00:48:10.106
But the kids at the time one of his cover businesses for the military intelligence work was he's like a, not a contractor, but like they would do remodeling jobs and stuff.

00:48:10.106 --> 00:48:15.750
So anyway, one of the jobs he was doing was one of his friends he would use like juvenile delinquents by do the grant work.

00:48:15.750 --> 00:48:20.568
It's today's equivalent almost of you know, you go hire day laborers, you know okay.

00:48:20.568 --> 00:48:28.498
And so they said the masterminded this big do kill the guy.

00:48:28.498 --> 00:48:37.364
They would, and it was 1982, there'd been floods in that area and so everybody's cash flow was really bad.

00:48:37.800 --> 00:48:52.347
And so they told the cops well, he, you know, masterminded this murder because the guy owes him money and we're gonna come and then sell off the antique cars that he sold or was working on and sell his auto, you know automotive tools and all this stuff.

00:48:52.347 --> 00:48:59.126
And so there was a dead body, the dead body floated up, that everybody got arrested.

00:48:59.126 --> 00:49:04.027
So he was convicted of first degree murder, even though and they said, he helped them dump the body.

00:49:04.027 --> 00:49:14.806
But he didn't do any of that and but it's all circumstantial evidence and one of the kids got full immunity, and he changed his story several times.

00:49:14.806 --> 00:49:23.329
The other kid, or he's not a kid now, he is my age or yeah, whatever, he's in his sixties and he's still in prison too.

00:49:23.329 --> 00:49:30.527
He got 25 to life, but his parole keeps getting denied, so that's just insane.

00:49:30.980 --> 00:49:39.568
I know other countries you might have committed first degree murder, but you're not in prison that long, so that is just crazy, crazy, yeah.

00:49:40.039 --> 00:49:50.445
So I mean, we go from abusive to being neglected to wanting polygamy and just wanting just pretty much that's what they want to.

00:49:50.445 --> 00:49:57.262
You know to, okay, and then you know what I love about you know what you're saying is that you've been completely honest about it as well.

00:49:57.262 --> 00:49:57.603
Is that?

00:49:57.603 --> 00:49:58.679
Hey, one of these was man.

00:49:58.679 --> 00:50:00.266
You just want to want to be alone.

00:50:00.266 --> 00:50:12.746
And you know to a guy that you met in prison that had basically stated that he was going to be getting out of there soon and never did, and you ended up with him for 25 years.

00:50:12.820 --> 00:50:19.344
So you've got a lot of loyalty as well, I do, and my daughter bless her heart because you believe.

00:50:19.344 --> 00:50:25.166
I believe very strongly in the concept of love, you know, and I'm still hoping that someday I'll find the one.

00:50:25.166 --> 00:50:27.764
Do I ever need to get married again?

00:50:27.764 --> 00:50:29.543
No, but I do, I do.

00:50:29.543 --> 00:50:33.012
People can find a loving companion.

00:50:33.012 --> 00:50:34.804
There just needs to be a lot.

00:50:34.804 --> 00:50:35.387
You know.

00:50:35.387 --> 00:50:41.226
You need to tread lightly and investigate things more before you jump, you know.

00:50:41.519 --> 00:50:53.206
Yeah, so I definitely think that you know what you've said today and how you've gotten through this and just the light that you've got I mean that I could see you know your smile and your eyes are bright and the whole bit.

00:50:53.206 --> 00:51:00.826
And to get through this, because I know plenty of people that might have won these situations and they pretty much gave up on life.

00:51:00.826 --> 00:51:07.829
Not necessarily did they end up committing suicide, which you had to go through that as well, crazy.

00:51:08.201 --> 00:51:08.971
Tried not to.

00:51:09.639 --> 00:51:17.246
Yeah, I imagine, but it's just that they, you know, you don't see that, you don't see that there's a strength there that you've gotten.

00:51:17.246 --> 00:51:37.530
So that was my next question is that I know that you're also and we talked about and we're gonna dig into that right now as of basically the crone, what that means, what it is, but where in this span of time did you start delving into the paranormal, ufo, magical?

00:51:38.119 --> 00:51:38.902
Paranormal.

00:51:38.902 --> 00:51:50.547
I had the gift when I was married to husband number three and he I discovered it because he was a funeral director for a while and there was one time I have.

00:51:50.547 --> 00:52:04.849
I mean, he transported a body from Los Angeles up to Northern California and I'm standing there while he's doing this graveside service for this old lady who passed and her elderly relatives and all of a sudden it's like, oh well, she's right there.

00:52:04.849 --> 00:52:08.106
She's just standing right next to me just observing what's going on.

00:52:08.106 --> 00:52:12.347
It's like oh hello, and it's not like I could see her.

00:52:12.347 --> 00:52:22.369
I can just feel that Sometimes if I'm places I can see a shadow, and if I'm taking black and white photos you can see the energy.

00:52:22.369 --> 00:52:33.550
And then fast forward a year or two when we were living in Ohio, his sister's mother-in-law passed and I was seeing at the funeral.

00:52:33.550 --> 00:52:45.086
So I'm overlooking the audience, but I could tell that her spirit was like up in that corner and she's just hanging out watching her service, and so that was pretty cool and I kind of forgot it after that.

00:52:45.086 --> 00:53:02.568
And then it was when I met Mark and he didn't tell me about all the UFO stuff right away, it was more like and I was doing a newspaper at the time he got me to start this publishing company and it's like, well, okay, go check out this aircraft carrier because it's got some interesting military history.

00:53:02.568 --> 00:53:08.644
It's like, okay, and then now there's this psychic gonna be talking about all the ghosts on that aircraft carrier.

00:53:08.644 --> 00:53:10.166
Maybe you wanna go hear her speak.

00:53:10.166 --> 00:53:11.925
And it's like, oh yeah, this is cool.

00:53:11.925 --> 00:53:19.266
And so I hooked up with psychic and then she was a docent at the ship and it's out there.

00:53:19.266 --> 00:53:26.885
Well, what used to be Alameda Naval Air Station in Alameda, california, it's called the USS Hornet and it's famous.

00:53:26.885 --> 00:53:38.364
It's famous, but it's also it's famous for its military history and also for the ghosts on it, because there's a lot of sailors who died on that ship and also sailors who just wanna come hang out because it's a cool place.

00:53:39.000 --> 00:53:42.927
So I've been there several times, but I've been there two different psychics.

00:53:42.927 --> 00:53:51.989
But the first time it's like you're walking along the hallway and we were there after most of the visitors had gone, so it's like, oh, the wall's kinda cold and wet.

00:53:51.989 --> 00:53:59.722
And then we walked in where the anchors are, so the folks all and we walked up this ladder stairway thingy.

00:53:59.722 --> 00:54:08.085
She's going into where the bunks were and I'm up at the top of the ladder and it's like somebody's peeking out at me from around this column.

00:54:08.085 --> 00:54:10.724
It's like, oh, hello, and it was like the shadow.

00:54:10.724 --> 00:54:14.264
I can't see what it looked like when they were alive, but I can see their shadows.

00:54:14.264 --> 00:54:17.945
It's like, oh, hello, I'm friendly, I'm just saying hi, but I'm gonna go this way.

00:54:17.945 --> 00:54:33.827
And that was cool and to me it's not ever been scary, but it's really cool to know that spirits, because sometimes they hang out, because they like the place, sometimes they need help crossing over and I've only helped cross over one person.

00:54:33.827 --> 00:54:35.244
I mean it was a brother-in-law.

00:54:35.579 --> 00:54:47.402
But there were other spirits on that ship I've encountered and the two times I've been there with different psychics, my father-in-law, because he had some military events on that ship.

00:54:47.402 --> 00:54:54.288
He's always with me on the flight deck because he was an Air Force pilot and then when he died he was a major.

00:54:54.288 --> 00:55:02.271
But he's always right by me on the flight deck and I can feel him and the psychics that were with me.

00:55:02.271 --> 00:55:08.505
On two different times they could see him and that was so cool because he died before I ever met Mark.

00:55:08.505 --> 00:55:11.746
But he and I are great friends.

00:55:11.746 --> 00:55:22.806
I talked regularly through a channeling person and we have great conversations and I feel like we're friends.

00:55:22.806 --> 00:55:25.052
Yeah, so it's pretty cool.

00:55:25.521 --> 00:55:26.405
And there have been other places.

00:55:26.405 --> 00:55:32.789
I've been to historical places with psych well, usually with different psychics, but my psychic friend in England.

00:55:32.789 --> 00:55:42.070
We would go to different historical places and not that we were looking for the ghosts, but they were always there and she can see them as they were when they were alive.

00:55:42.070 --> 00:55:45.748
I can just feel the energy and, like I said, see shadows and stuff.

00:55:45.748 --> 00:55:51.668
But it's really cool to experience and just I don't know, I love it.

00:55:51.668 --> 00:55:58.648
We've also been in a couple places like we were in a castle one time where the level we were on was like the dungeon level.

00:55:58.648 --> 00:56:03.826
There was some friendly not friendly spirits there and she goes, we gotta go, I go, yeah, let's go.

00:56:03.826 --> 00:56:11.472
And so sometimes you can feel that and yeah, it's lovely, I love it.

00:56:11.940 --> 00:56:13.385
I've talked through the handling person.

00:56:13.500 --> 00:56:17.007
I've talked to different people and through my psychic friend in England.

00:56:17.099 --> 00:56:23.530
I've talked to different people and usually when I was giving talks, my father-in-law would stand.

00:56:23.530 --> 00:56:25.440
He was always there.

00:56:25.440 --> 00:56:27.601
If it was like a private home, he would be there.

00:56:27.601 --> 00:56:44.985
If it was like at a conference, he was always behind my left shoulder and I know he was there and usually there was like this whole array of beings you know behind me and because I used to give a lot of talks about different aliens and stuff, so there's always I have a spirit guide.

00:56:44.985 --> 00:56:47.965
That's a reptilian one time every season.

00:56:47.965 --> 00:56:56.039
She's always like right here, and especially in this one talk I gave, and she's just right there and she's like that's really hot and there were.

00:56:56.039 --> 00:56:59.161
I think she came up to me and said do you know who was all behind you?

00:56:59.161 --> 00:57:09.882
I go, yeah, and it's like okay, now I don't necessarily know the story, but I believe that you know these things are with you and protect you and you know it's cool.

00:57:09.882 --> 00:57:11.960
That's another support that I have.

00:57:11.960 --> 00:57:15.739
You know, the spirit realm a big, important part for me.

00:57:16.735 --> 00:57:20.481
I was just about to say that I'm like okay, so you've got a living support system.

00:57:20.481 --> 00:57:27.023
And then you've got one on the paranormal side, across the veil, If we want to use Hollywood terms.

00:57:27.023 --> 00:57:40.282
So those are my two last questions for you Is one is where does, now that you I've been experienced now with this since husband number three where does Hollywood get it right?

00:57:40.875 --> 00:57:42.175
That's a good question, you know.

00:57:42.175 --> 00:57:44.163
I just believe the spirits are right here.

00:57:44.163 --> 00:57:51.322
There's no other side, you know, and again, I've learned, I mean there's no other special place.

00:57:51.322 --> 00:57:53.221
I mean the spirit world is right here.

00:57:53.221 --> 00:58:00.561
You just have to tap into it and the concept of heaven and whatever I mean it's so different than what I learned at church.

00:58:00.561 --> 00:58:05.762
You know, it's so different, you know, it's like I no longer believe in the Christian God.

00:58:05.762 --> 00:58:08.302
And it's so funny because we've learned.

00:58:08.302 --> 00:58:14.318
You know, jesus is just having a great time and he's fishing, you know, and he's a great teacher and so.

00:58:14.318 --> 00:58:26.280
But again, when I met Mark and we started talking about other spiritual things, I left the Mormon church after 30 years and I said I don't need this anymore and I, you know, discovered a new path and new things to just learn about.

00:58:26.280 --> 00:58:36.882
And yeah, so I, through the channeling person, you know, we've talked to different kinds of great teachers and masters from long ago.

00:58:37.375 --> 00:58:41.184
So yeah, so that's and that's, that's absolutely.

00:58:41.184 --> 00:58:42.840
I mean I am, I am to what you just said.

00:58:42.840 --> 00:58:45.362
I just need to step back to my question real quick.

00:58:45.402 --> 00:58:45.722
Okay, sorry.

00:58:46.235 --> 00:58:49.617
Maybe you might not be someone that watches movies or TVs or something like that.

00:58:49.617 --> 00:58:50.902
I do, so my okay.

00:58:50.902 --> 00:59:00.166
So my biggest thing that I go back to is because they it uses a bunch of the of the slash rhetoric from a lot of the other movies.

00:59:00.166 --> 00:59:02.081
Is the program called?

00:59:02.081 --> 00:59:03.224
That was called Supernatural.

00:59:03.224 --> 00:59:04.137
It was on for 11 years.

00:59:04.197 --> 00:59:05.240
Oh, I remember that yeah.

00:59:06.994 --> 00:59:08.501
And it was a fantastic show, all of it.

00:59:08.501 --> 00:59:15.016
But, okay, salt about keeping you know put, blocking the salt that the they cannot cross, you know.

00:59:15.016 --> 00:59:17.057
So a ghost can't cross, so that's like one.

00:59:17.057 --> 00:59:20.641
You got the the cross and the vampires, I don't care about that one.

00:59:20.641 --> 00:59:23.739
Yeah, but there was a salt.

00:59:23.739 --> 00:59:32.403
There was burning the bones of the person that the ghost was from to help them cross over or so that they couldn't do harm.

00:59:32.403 --> 00:59:37.420
So there's all these little things that I was like I was that was comes into mind which are talking about it.

00:59:37.954 --> 00:59:43.204
Salt is a good thing for protection anyway, regardless of I mean, it's just a good protection thing.

00:59:43.204 --> 00:59:46.043
So a lot of times you know you might put salt.

00:59:46.043 --> 00:59:52.664
I've been put, you know, like on the windowsills and stuff, so and what was the other one?

00:59:52.664 --> 00:59:55.083
I don't know anything about burning bones.

00:59:55.083 --> 01:00:00.543
It's like the one time I've helped cross my brother-in-law over and somebody was helping me do that.

01:00:00.543 --> 01:00:07.856
It's like you're just talking to them, you know, and I've watched my English friend that, but it's basically you're just talking to the spirit, you don't.

01:00:07.856 --> 01:00:09.782
We didn't special with anything.

01:00:10.163 --> 01:00:13.016
So so, so do you.

01:00:13.016 --> 01:00:21.523
The spirits that you do talk to you don't feel like they're, they're not crossing over because they've got some unfinished business.

01:00:21.523 --> 01:00:23.201
There's another Hollywood rhetoric.

01:00:24.074 --> 01:00:34.364
Well, like on the Hornet, for example, some of them served on that ship so they want to hang out there and some of them just really like, I guess, the vibe there.

01:00:34.364 --> 01:00:47.239
There were other spirits, so I don't know why and I don't, I don't even, I'm not an expert on this, so it's like they may have crossed over, but you know, it's like maybe their spirit just wants to come and visit every now and then.

01:00:47.239 --> 01:00:51.844
When I talk through the channeling medium, those people are all in the spirit world.

01:00:51.844 --> 01:00:55.880
I'm, you know, talking to them and they're, you know, we're just having a conversation.

01:00:55.994 --> 01:01:03.963
It's not like anyway it's, but it's not like they haven't crossed over, but you can still talk to them from wherever they are.

01:01:04.425 --> 01:01:11.981
So Okay, so there's a piece of Hollywood rhetoric that I would say is probably is kind of what you're talking about is they use.

01:01:11.981 --> 01:01:22.063
There's two programs that I remember using the youth they called it the veil whereas just you're saying is like there's just this veil that keeps us from seeing the spirit world all the time.

01:01:22.063 --> 01:01:31.641
And you know and the spirits can cross through the veil at certain points in time and they can cross back at certain points in time in certain places.

01:01:32.275 --> 01:01:35.661
Again, Hollywood rhetoric I would just, and I totally this is.

01:01:35.934 --> 01:01:45.003
This is totally tangential, because I was just super curious, because I've never met anybody that could actually speak and see in the spirit world.

01:01:45.003 --> 01:01:47.722
I've never discounted it for this reason.

01:01:48.335 --> 01:01:50.884
Yeah, it's not like I can't see into the spirit world.

01:01:50.884 --> 01:01:58.719
I'm just talking to people who are in the spirit world and we have great conversations and they describe, but it's, but I mean it's just again.

01:01:58.719 --> 01:02:03.860
It's not like, yeah, it's totally different than what I hear in the Christian world.

01:02:03.900 --> 01:02:05.880
So yeah, no, I can imagine.

01:02:06.536 --> 01:02:11.202
And it's a place of love, you know, and it's not all humans, but, and it's a pluv.

01:02:11.755 --> 01:02:30.922
So I've always believed in and I know this is not about me and it's never is it gonna be about me but yeah, my whole belief system was that it's kind of going into science, right, we know that the body is made up of a ton of electricity and energy, and we also know through science that energy cannot be destroyed but it can be changed.

01:02:30.922 --> 01:02:37.663
So I believe that when our body's time is over, it doesn't mean that that energy has stopped.

01:02:37.663 --> 01:02:39.141
It's gotta change in some form.

01:02:39.141 --> 01:02:47.425
And I always thought that that's what you know, that Christians, jews, we feel like that is the soul.

01:02:47.425 --> 01:02:56.981
You know that soul is energy, right, and maybe what you're seeing spiritually is those are those souls, right, and that soul is energy.

01:02:56.981 --> 01:03:03.541
So, however it manifests itself is, you know, is a point of contention, a point of belief?

01:03:03.954 --> 01:03:05.815
Right right, so yeah.

01:03:06.016 --> 01:03:06.516
And the beauty?

01:03:06.516 --> 01:03:08.684
The beauty is I've learned through.

01:03:08.684 --> 01:03:13.385
I've learned a lot from some great, masterful teachers.

01:03:13.385 --> 01:03:21.047
I've also learned like I've talked to my parents and it's like my mom has learned so much after death.

01:03:21.047 --> 01:03:23.541
It's like, yeah, they don't stop learning.

01:03:23.541 --> 01:03:25.922
You know, you have another air base.

01:03:25.922 --> 01:03:27.936
I mean it's like you don't stop, you don't.

01:03:27.936 --> 01:03:32.317
Okay, now I'm gonna sit and do nothing, I mean unless you want to, but I mean she's.

01:03:32.317 --> 01:03:33.882
I mean I've had conversations with her.

01:03:33.882 --> 01:03:48.300
When she's talking to me about quantum stuff and it's like, whoa, that was not my mom when she was alive, you know, unless she just always played dumb or not very intellectual, you know, but she was great wisdom and great knowledge about quantum physics and stuff.

01:03:48.300 --> 01:03:51.199
It's like, well, this is cool, you know, let's talk more.

01:03:51.199 --> 01:03:55.402
So, yeah, my parents have totally changed since they've died.

01:03:56.445 --> 01:03:58.840
Wow, okay, that is interesting.

01:03:58.840 --> 01:04:01.079
Yeah, and now I'm okay.

01:04:01.079 --> 01:04:10.880
So my parents are aging and I love them very much and I hope they live forever, but I'm gonna come see you when the time must be come, because I'd like to know what they're gonna be doing.

01:04:10.880 --> 01:04:20.000
So my very last question is let's go back to the crone, okay, and if you can explain that to me and the audience will wrap up.

01:04:20.581 --> 01:04:25.277
Okay, the crone is a wise woman, so it doesn't.

01:04:25.277 --> 01:04:29.824
You don't have to be old, but you know I'm almost 70, so I like it.

01:04:29.824 --> 01:04:36.106
I just call myself the wise woman crone because I've learned so much through all these experiences.

01:04:36.106 --> 01:04:48.882
So, and you don't have to be a witch to, you know you can all learn, but I've embraced a magical practice, so you know spells, intentions and just honoring nature.

01:04:48.882 --> 01:05:04.362
It's like I get so much out of taking a walk and being near the trees here, and I live near some foresty parks and you know I just love being here in the nature and it just it all in my soul and I get a lot of inspiration that way.

01:05:04.454 --> 01:05:21.246
So again, it's just a matter of and then tuning into your wisdom and tuning into your intuition, because when I listen and I do it, then it's like, ah, there's nothing I can't do and I've gotten a lot of good inspiration.

01:05:21.246 --> 01:05:26.900
I mean, when I, when I'm out of walk, I'll often get, especially if I'm prepared to talk it's like, oh yeah, this is what you should say.

01:05:26.900 --> 01:05:28.420
It's like, oh yeah, good.

01:05:28.420 --> 01:05:31.960
And I, or working on my book, oh yeah, this is what you should, how you?

01:05:31.960 --> 01:05:33.344
Okay, thank you.

01:05:33.344 --> 01:05:43.057
So you know, intuition comes and the guidance, and I believe I'm guided from many sources and you know I've got some powerful friends on the other side.

01:05:43.077 --> 01:05:53.900
Yeah, that is so interesting and I think we might just have to, you know, give this a constant meet back up and just kind of delve in for even more of the magic side of it.

01:05:54.635 --> 01:06:08.505
But I definitely need to read your book and I wanna and I'm working on another book and we'll talk about that as we wrap up but I just wanna wrap up and every time I have been ending this with just a series of the takeaways basically from it.

01:06:08.505 --> 01:06:25.041
So, through everything you've been and through all the experiences good, bad husbands, and then learning about the paranormal basically what with the biggest part that I've come to find that you've talked about is having that support system.

01:06:25.514 --> 01:06:29.438
It sounds like with a support system you can pretty much get through anything.

01:06:30.282 --> 01:06:45.202
Yes, and I've also learned that it's not selfish to take care of yourself and you can put yourself first without being selfish, Because if you're not your best self and if you're not happy with yourself, then you're not gonna be any good to anybody else.

01:06:45.202 --> 01:06:48.563
So I now take way better care of myself.

01:06:48.563 --> 01:06:50.521
I stand up for myself.

01:06:50.521 --> 01:06:54.762
It's probably why I'm not getting a lot of dates, because I'm very transparent.

01:06:54.762 --> 01:07:01.525
I'm a Leo, so it's like I tell you like it is, but so I'm finding that area.

01:07:01.525 --> 01:07:04.860
But it's like taking care of yourself and standing up for yourself.

01:07:05.255 --> 01:07:08.985
And the other thing is know that you can change, no matter how old you are.

01:07:08.985 --> 01:07:10.418
You can change your life.

01:07:10.418 --> 01:07:33.757
If you need a better path, Get the help you need and you don't have to do it on your own, Because part of my new work with the new book that's coming out is to offer some peer support for people who are struggling, Because it's like maybe you can't leave that relationship, but if you can and you, or if you should and you can go ahead, Don't feel guilty.

01:07:33.757 --> 01:07:40.164
If it's bad when you're kids, or even just you, it's like it's okay to leave.

01:07:40.976 --> 01:07:41.679
And yeah.

01:07:41.679 --> 01:07:47.478
Yeah, I think, in order to be happy on this side of the veil.

01:07:47.478 --> 01:07:57.065
It's a short life and we need to make sure that whatever we do is for is fair, and we need to be as happy as we possibly can.

01:07:57.065 --> 01:07:59.402
And then you said therapy is good.

01:07:59.775 --> 01:08:00.719
Therapy is great.

01:08:02.077 --> 01:08:07.362
Don't start, don't blame the stigma, but we also talked about that.

01:08:07.362 --> 01:08:12.621
When finding a therapist, it is okay for you to walk away if you do not feel that there is chemistry.

01:08:13.114 --> 01:08:14.219
Yeah, you do need to find one.

01:08:14.219 --> 01:08:19.243
I luckily found one, my number seven, mark.

01:08:19.243 --> 01:08:20.346
He's a narcissist.

01:08:20.346 --> 01:08:25.027
I didn't know that until we'd already been together 20 years.

01:08:25.027 --> 01:08:29.560
I didn't know that until I realized that's a whole other story.

01:08:29.560 --> 01:08:32.423
But it's like oh, things aren't working for me.

01:08:32.423 --> 01:08:33.960
Oh, now it's COVID.

01:08:33.960 --> 01:08:41.663
It's like I just finally hit a point where I needed to stand up for myself, and speaking up to a narcissist doesn't work well.

01:08:41.663 --> 01:08:45.323
So it took us several years to untangle.

01:08:45.323 --> 01:08:53.363
There's still some dramas going on, but book number two is all about dealing, navigating through narcissistic abuse Excellent.

01:08:53.935 --> 01:08:55.822
Yeah, I would definitely be looking forward to that one.

01:08:55.822 --> 01:09:08.864
And the last thing that was actually one of the one of the you had mentioned way in the beginning of this episode was communicate, communicate, communicate, and know someone before you make that big plunge.

01:09:09.534 --> 01:09:12.881
Yeah, and everybody's communications might be a little bit different.

01:09:12.881 --> 01:09:14.119
So figure that out.

01:09:14.119 --> 01:09:26.023
And if you need a therapist to help you figure it out, but also, if they're not willing and I say this on my dating profiles I need to find somebody who's willing to talk about the hard stuff, because Mark wasn't.

01:09:26.023 --> 01:09:37.921
We'd skirt around the issues and I'd get these vague answers and then I'd get all the gaslighting and the bullying and it was all my fault and that's where all my one-liners come in.

01:09:37.980 --> 01:09:40.541
So yeah, so that might that you might do.

01:09:40.541 --> 01:09:44.180
You might have to do a bathroom book and all on one-liners that.

01:09:44.662 --> 01:09:45.184
Good point.

01:09:45.184 --> 01:09:47.641
Yeah, you never know, you never know.

01:09:47.641 --> 01:09:49.159
I've got the list started.

01:09:49.159 --> 01:09:54.439
It's in the intro for the book, but yeah, Perfect, yeah, so, joanne, thank you.

01:09:54.654 --> 01:09:55.458
Thank you so much.

01:09:55.458 --> 01:10:06.021
I have got your socials Great and we can talk about any other contact information that, if anybody has any questions that they can.

01:10:06.114 --> 01:10:08.961
Good yeah because I have a new website that's about to be live.

01:10:08.961 --> 01:10:09.957
But you can.

01:10:09.957 --> 01:10:20.807
You can email Joanne at joannefaucetcom, and yet for my email list I've got some helpful flyers about narcissistic abuse and all that kind of stuff.

01:10:20.807 --> 01:10:24.123
So yeah, there's life to go on bookkeeping.

01:10:25.114 --> 01:10:27.016
Yes, yes Again.

01:10:27.016 --> 01:10:27.921
Thank you so much.

01:10:27.921 --> 01:10:34.182
This has been an amazing episode, especially for, you know, for this it's a brand new podcast.

01:10:34.182 --> 01:10:35.560
That seems to be.

01:10:35.560 --> 01:10:38.743
It's taken off, even though today was the first day I was launched.

01:10:38.743 --> 01:10:46.061
Oh well, in this, in this time, hearing this, because this will probably launch on Wednesday, next Wednesday, on the 13th.

01:10:46.061 --> 01:10:49.043
So, yes, thank you so much.

01:10:49.043 --> 01:10:50.180
This has been incredible.

01:10:50.180 --> 01:10:51.559
I love this conversation.

01:10:51.658 --> 01:10:53.345
Well, wonderful, I really appreciate it.

01:10:53.345 --> 01:10:55.078
Oh, thanks for having me, yeah.

01:10:55.180 --> 01:10:55.480
Great.

01:10:55.480 --> 01:10:59.104
Well, thank you, and we'll talk to you next time.

01:10:59.414 --> 01:10:59.618
Yeah.

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